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Offline Harley

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« Reply #45 on: October 07, 2004, 02:15:30 PM »
Lead, when you refer to the "American Taliban" to whom are you referring?  The Government or some Religious groups, or both perhaps?  http://www.commondreams.org/views01/1210-07.htm
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 05:00:00 PM by Harley »
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Offline heroicfighter199

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« Reply #46 on: October 07, 2004, 02:30:08 PM »
Here are some verses from the quaran read them then tell me if islam is a religion of peace (scroll down) ... It is very obvious that islam is not a religion of peace, while the bible never tells people to kill any unbeleivers, there are some Christians who did so, like the crusaders, but the bible never told them to do so you can not say the bible told them to do so. The Muslims on the other hand are told to do so by there quaran ( There are many more verses like the ones below). In Saudi Arabia (Muslim country) it is against the law to read a bible unless it is in the privacy of your home the penalty to that is beheading. There are some peacfull muslims but a LARGE amount of them are VIOLENT.


From The quaran:
"Slay the idolaters wherever you find them. ... lie in ambush everywhere for them. If they repent and take to prayer and render the alms levy, allow them to go their way ..." (9:5)

The believers who stay at home––apart from those that suffer a grave impediment––are not the equals of those who fight for the cause of God with their goods and their persons. God has given those that fight with their goods and their persons a higher rank than those who stay at home ..." (4:95,96)

Let those who would exchange the life of this world for the hereafter, fight for the cause of God; whether he dies or triumphs, We shall richly reward him. ... The true believers fight for the cause of God, but the infidels fight for the devil. Fight then against the friends of Satan ..." (4:74,76)

"Make war on them until idolatry shall cease and God's religion shall reign supreme" (8:39)
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 05:00:00 PM by heroicfighter199 »
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Offline KamikazeSM

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« Reply #47 on: September 21, 2004, 05:54:05 PM »
<blockquote id="quote"><font size="1" face="Verdana" id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"><i>Originally posted by leadmagnet</i>
Over the last 200 plus years, the American Taliban have disenfranchised individuals and groups, broken apart family units and destroyed cultures, incarcerated and caused the deaths of millions of our citizens in order to impose their religious ideals and be And what have they done?  They provide invaluable information which has led to improved airplane design which saves lives.  Installing these devices in cars should be seen as even more of a safety necessity since car accidents kill so many thousands of people each year.

The idea that how you drive your car is a "private" matter is just plain wrong to begin with.  Like leakingpen said, driving is a priviledge, not a right.  The government allows you to use your vehicle on the condition that you drive responsibly and safely.  To do otherwise violates the rights of other drivers.

I am confident that the government will not be able to track your vehicle or control it via these "black boxes" for one simple reason: the 4th ammendment.  There's no probable cause, therefore no legal basis for such an action.  Any judge would quickly rule against such a device for violating our 4th ammendment guarantee against unreasonable search and seizure.  Without a warrant their hands are tied.

If you are really concerned about the government invading your privacy I would suggest that you stop using the internet then.[;)]
<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote"></font id="quote">

Once again, we're blurring the subject. Yes, your right, driving is a privledge. Your privacy, however, is a natural right. This is not about driving so much as it is a violation of your privacy. I mean no offense when I say that I cannot take you on your word (or "trust") that NOT A SINGLE PERSON in the government will abuse this. To them, probable cause be damned if they can get away with it. Abuse of power is a human tendency that I've observed all too many times throughout history. I've said it and so have many others: I love my country but I will never completely trust my government.
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 05:00:00 PM by KamikazeSM »
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Offline Victor3

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« Reply #48 on: October 08, 2004, 09:06:35 AM »
Yeah, I'm interested too in just who you're refering to as the "American Taliban"?
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 05:00:00 PM by Victor3 »
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Offline heroicfighter199

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« Reply #49 on: October 08, 2004, 05:39:13 PM »
What in the world is the "America Taliban"??????
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 05:00:00 PM by heroicfighter199 »
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Offline PyroManiac

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« Reply #50 on: October 08, 2004, 06:54:45 PM »
Hey lead, if you hate america or americans...no one is making you stay here. Why dont you just move to Iraq or Afganistan so you can meet the REAL taliban and im sure they'd just love to make a "special guest". How dare you compare america to those guys.
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 05:00:00 PM by PyroManiac »
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Offline busta_cap

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« Reply #51 on: October 08, 2004, 07:14:39 PM »
Personnally, you are all getting worked up over something that is nothing. If you want to go somewhere and have a formal "debate" or discussion then do it. People get so worked up on message boards and forums and online..for what? Its just someone on the other end of his computer typing away. Hell it could be some 90 year old man or a 12 year old kid pissing you off..Which is why I stay away from most of the political,religous and off topic debates on these boards. And when I see people who are my age(15)(not naming names[:P]) say idiotic and disrespectfull things to anyone, it pisses me off. As Hav would say: "Yo! All ya'll need to chill". Anyways, as far as for the beheadings and executions..there not getting the people who are doing it anywhere. I wish everyone could just get along around here. Sometimes I think Paco thinks about deleting everyones account..Hehe..

On a side note: Ive been watching the presidential debate and stopped watching after about 45 minutes. Im really sick of political BS-run-around-the-truth answers that don't answer the question AT ALL.
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 05:00:00 PM by busta_cap »

Offline leadmagnet

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« Reply #52 on: October 11, 2004, 10:04:56 PM »
You guys have just exemplified in this thread why the “American Talibanâ€￾ is so insidious and dangerous to our nation.  You haven't a clue as to the horror in your midst, horrors that have been perpetuated to those around you in one way or another as a result of Christian dogma and fanaticism and which continue to this day.  

And the only two possibilities of what I may be referring to that anyone could come up with in this thread is the genocide of the indigenous people of this continent and the treatment of the Japanese in WWII?!!!

<blockquote id="quote"><font size="1" face="Verdana" id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">Originally posted by KamikazeSM  The best I can tell, you're referring to the plight of the Native Americans and possibly the internment of the Japanese during WWII.  Neither of these occurred a result of wanting "to impose their religious ideals and beliefs" on either involved party.  
 <hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote"></font id="quote">

How ridiculous to state that those two occurrences weren't substantially related to Christian fanaticism in dealing with what the American Taliban perceived as “godless red heathensâ€￾ and the “pagan yellow perilâ€￾.

But no gentlemen, those were not the two examples I had in mind.

There are examples far more contemporary.  

All you need do is open your eyes to what is happening around you to see one of the most glaring examples of the American Taliban's handiwork at it's finest.

I'm not so sure pepto bismol can do the job, Nick.  :3)

Lead
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 05:00:00 PM by leadmagnet »

Offline leadmagnet

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« Reply #53 on: October 11, 2004, 10:14:10 PM »
<blockquote id="quote"><font size="1" face="Verdana" id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"><i>Originally posted by PyroManiac</i>
<br />Hey lead, if you hate america or americans...no one is making you stay here. Why dont you just move to Iraq or Afganistan so you can meet the REAL taliban and im sure they'd just love to make a "special guest". How dare you compare america to those guys.
<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote"></font id="quote">

No, Pyro.  I only have an issue with the "American Taliban".  And why bust loose with the cash for a plane ticket when I can find them right here at home?

Of course the insistence that one must hate all Americans because one recognizes the American Taliban for what they are is exactly what they (the American Taliban) would like us to think.

Lead
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 05:00:00 PM by leadmagnet »

Offline leadmagnet

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« Reply #54 on: October 11, 2004, 10:31:10 PM »
<blockquote id="quote"><font size="1" face="Verdana" id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">Originally posted by yellowmonkey Pulling out of Vietnam was a mistake. Pulling out of Iraq would be a mistake.
<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote"></font id="quote">

Pulling out of Vietnam was a MISTAKE?!!!

Inside every Vietnamese is an American trying to get out, right?

Let's see, 50,000 American dead in ten years.  If we had stayed that number could have been over 200,000!  What a "success story" that would have been.  And just think, there are countries all over the world just like Vietnam.  Heck, if we tried hard enough we could lose millions!  What a "success story" that would be.

Lead
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 05:00:00 PM by leadmagnet »

Offline KamikazeSM

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« Reply #55 on: October 11, 2004, 11:35:38 PM »
Lead, I'm still waiting on examples.  And the above references were an attempt to figure out what the "long history of oppression by the American Taliban" or however you put it was referring to.  I honestly would like some real examples, not just for argument's sake, but for my own edification.  Granted, I think we have a largely differing opinion on this, but throw me a bone as to what you mean explicitly so I can chew on it.  Saying that it's so insidious that we don't even see it is way too hand-wavy for me.
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 05:00:00 PM by KamikazeSM »
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Offline TheCelticOne

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« Reply #56 on: October 13, 2004, 02:37:39 AM »
You know what, the "American Taliban" is #1 in the world in terms of power and generosity.  We can have guns.  We can talk trash about our leaders.  We have all these rights (whether you agree with them or not, everyone, that's not the point).

1) You don't get to be #1 in power unless you're doing something right.
2) The "American Taliban" (a disgusting phrase to me personally) has given more money to other countries, the citizens of those countries, and charities than most other countries combined.  Before you get into the argument of "well, we're just doing it to increase our empire," remember this:  if we weren't doing it, people would be screaming that we were being selfish with our great economy and don't care.  

As far as the religion of Islam goes, Islam is not a peaceful religion.  It can be practiced peacefully; just because you know someone who is a Muslim does NOT make you an expert on the matter.  There are three levels of Islamic practice:  Common, Fundamentalist, and Extremist.  Common is the layman practice; Fundamentalist is the brutal side of Islam.  Most Arabic countries are ruled by a fundamentalist Islamic statehood.  That is using the Koran as a complete guidebook, and no mercy for crimes, but does not support unnecessary killing of anyone.  The last one, extremist Islam, is practiced by terrorists, where they are to "slaughter the infidel at every chance," and make them submit to the supreme will of Allah (I say Allah here to show that there IS a difference in the characteristics of the Judeo-Christian God and the Islamic Allah).

However, more fascinating than that is that the Qur'an  alternates itself in a parallel pattern to that of historical record; Mohammad was a general and a prophet of Islam.  Historically, when his forces were strong, he would march on and make war, writing in what would become the Qur'an that Allah has inspired to him what he should do; and when his forces were weak, outnumbered, or ill-supplied, he would declare a temporary truce, and write that "the Jews and Christians are the neighbors of Islam, and friends as close to a Musselman as one can be" ("Muslim" is a modern compacting of the original "Musselman").


Lastly, a belief system's ideals attempt to stay true to the founder's beliefs; Buddhists listen to the teachings of Prince Siddharta (later to rename himself Gautama, and eventually Buddha), Christians attempt to imitate Jesus Christ (and fail, granted, but that is their objective), etc.
The Harper Collins Concise Guide to World Religions (authored by Mircea Eliad and Ioan Couliano, (c)1991 HarperCollins) says "Along with leadership in prayer and ritual, he was occupied with dozens of raiding expeditions against enemies of Medina and his opponents in Mecca.  Caravan raids escalated into something of a war between Mecca and Medina, accompanied by negotiations toward the conversion of the Meccans."  Regardless of what they now call Islam, a religion of peace, Islam spread under the sword.
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 05:00:00 PM by TheCelticOne »
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Offline Greg

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Another beheading in Iraq
« Reply #57 on: September 20, 2004, 04:43:15 PM »
I wish our f***ing media would stop re-broadcasting the damn videos of this crap.[V]

I guess there isn't really much else to say about this.

http://www.cnn.com/2004/WORLD/meast/09/20/iraq.beheading/index.html
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 05:00:00 PM by Greg »
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