I'm glad we never have to play with kids

[Ranger_Robby]

and i honestly do not see the relationship between what kind of music i listen to and how i conduct myself at an airsoft game. i geuss i just missed the memo where you have to listen to a certain kind of music to have a good future.

um, I think that song is from a certain part in the movie Officespace where the main charactors' true gangster heritage is shown as the beat down in placed on the local unfriendly office fax machine... if you dont know what I'm talking about you definitly wont understand the correlation between that song and the video... and you'd probably too young to understand when to slow your roll... "PC load letter... What the F**K does that mean?"

[Firehead]

"PC load letter... What the F**K does that mean?"

I found out what that means...

...it means the machine is out of paper.

[Phreakish]

"paper jam?, there is no god**** paper jam!"

[Patty o' Brian]

yes i did see the correlation between office space and my statement . but what i do not see is how if i listen to rap( or any other music) i automaticaly will use airsoft in a bad way. and also by your terms, since i listen to country i am a redneck. music does not define my actions. only i can choose to do something. music will not automatically turn me into something i am not.

If a minor goes through the trouble to find an organized game, purchase and learn about  high end guns and equipment. then i think they should know how to use airsoft properly. its like going through the trouble of creating a fast drag racing car yet not knowing how to drive. yes there are kids that use airsoft irresponsable, but saying that the responsible minors cannot attend your games is just preventing them from getting further in to the hobby.

[Phreakish]

You must realize that for organized games, its also a liability issue.  There are countless other reasons that minors are disallowed at many games, irresponsibility aside.

[Doc Hollywood]

You must realize that for organized games, its also a liability issue.  There are countless other reasons that minors are disallowed at many games, irresponsibility aside.

Sorry to inform you that there is no liability created by organizing a game.

Tort law 101 for non - lawyers...

you must have a legal duty to do something; then

you must fail to do that thing you have a LEGAL duty to do; then

that failure must LEGALLY cause some damage to someone; who

did not CONSENT to or knowingly assume the risk of loss...

that aside, who you going to sue???   a non-existant asset-less LLC (like any smart LLC) ...  and who you going to call... Phillips & Associates?

Quit using the law as an excuse because it isn't one.

IMHO

[Firehead]

You must realize that for organized games, its also a liability issue.  There are countless other reasons that minors are disallowed at many games, irresponsibility aside.

Sorry to inform you that there is no liability created by organizing a game.

Tort law 101 for non - lawyers...

you must have a legal duty to do something; then

you must fail to do that thing you have a LEGAL duty to do; then

that failure must LEGALLY cause some damage to someone; who

did not CONSENT to or knowingly assume the risk of loss...

that aside, who you going to sue???   a non-existant asset-less LLC (like any smart LLC) ...  and who you going to call... Phillips & Associates?

Quit using the law as an excuse because it isn't one.

IMHO

...but...a MINOR doesn't have that legal ability to give that consent, does he? Isn't the point that the kid isn't the problem, its the parents? Isn't that the reason why schools use permission slips to go on a field trip?

Example:

Kid goes to game.
Kid understands risk of being hit with bb.
Kid is under 18, therfore has no legal say about anything.
Kid gets hurt.
Parents flip.
Parents then sue the organizer of the game.

[Twitchy Konigkeit]

see but shoudn't  that be voides since he understood the rules, and that is the purpose of a waiver is it not to prevent things like that. i really think that you should be taught to be resposible befor you play. the reason i was allowed to buy an airsoft gun when i was like what 12 or 13 was because i took a rifle corse...in the boyscouts(don't give me **** plz, it was stupid i'm done wiht it) anyway i got a merit badge but took a big corse on it the safty and all, so i understood rifle safty. then i started small and worked up in the airsoft world to understand better, and i knew not to go into public wiht it flying about (though one ex member of the team went to shoot across the street with his M16A2 and the cops were called non the less!, that was fun) but still that is why waivers are in use, but i think some class or something should be brought in before the actual gun (spring, gas, elecric, What ever)

[E-raq]

I think the funny part is these kids don't know what celebrities they are. All around the nation there are airsoft forums watching their video and discussing how stupid they are.  =D>

[Ranger_Robby]

yes i did see the correlation between office space and my statement . but what i do not see is how if i listen to rap( or any other music) i automaticaly will use airsoft in a bad way. and also by your terms, since i listen to country i am a redneck. music does not define my actions. only i can choose to do something. music will not automatically turn me into something i am not.

it's not the movie and your statement... it's the part of the movie and the video! did I speak it in another language?

[Twitchy Konigkeit]

yes i did see the correlation between office space and my statement . but what i do not see is how if i listen to rap( or any other music) i automaticaly will use airsoft in a bad way. and also by your terms, since i listen to country i am a redneck. music does not define my actions. only i can choose to do something. music will not automatically turn me into something i am not.

If a minor goes through the trouble to find an organized game, purchase and learn about  high end guns and equipment. then i think they should know how to use airsoft properly. its like going through the trouble of creating a fast drag racing car yet not knowing how to drive. yes there are kids that use airsoft irresponsable, but saying that the responsible minors cannot attend your games is just preventing them from getting further in to the hobby.

well as Preakish said reliability, but also think physicaly and mentaly, but besides that, as you said that it prevents them from furthering into the hobby i disagree.  buy telling them that they will have to strive to learn how to be more responsible and better if they are dedicated enough to push them selve to what more professional players want, that is how i see it.  like i'm only 16 i can't go to offical AA games but i understand that i have to grow, and become better, and more responsible, but i also know that they do it due to reliablity which is totaly understandable.

[warlock]

You must realize that for organized games, its also a liability issue.  There are countless other reasons that minors are disallowed at many games, irresponsibility aside.

Sorry to inform you that there is no liability created by organizing a game.

Tort law 101 for non - lawyers...

you must have a legal duty to do something; then

you must fail to do that thing you have a LEGAL duty to do; then

that failure must LEGALLY cause some damage to someone; who

did not CONSENT to or knowingly assume the risk of loss...

that aside, who you going to sue???   a non-existant asset-less LLC (like any smart LLC) ...  and who you going to call... Phillips & Associates?

Quit using the law as an excuse because it isn't one.

IMHO

...but...a MINOR doesn't have that legal ability to give that consent, does he? Isn't the point that the kid isn't the problem, its the parents? Isn't that the reason why schools use permission slips to go on a field trip?

Example:

Kid goes to game.
Kid understands risk of being hit with bb.
Kid is under 18, therfore has no legal say about anything.
Kid gets hurt.
Parents flip.
Parents then sue the organizer of the game.

I still fail to see where the organizer has failed to do something they were legally required to do.

FWIW, 13 years old seems to be (in a legal sense) the age where one can argue that the person in question (yes, even a minor) can knowingly make an informed decision and is capable of understanding the risks involved towards themselves. They might not be able to legally sign anything, but that's what parental waivers are for. But under the tort rules as Doc displayed above (great layman's translation btw) the kid would be arguably disbanding the third rule, making all 3 senses invalid and releasing any legal claim.

[Firehead]

The organizer didn't do anything wrong, and even if the kid can make an informed decision, that still doesn't keep the parent from initiating legal action, does it? The suing parents may not win, but who wants to go through the trouble? I'm not saying I'm right, I'm just trying to understand it completely.

[Rafterman]

You all missed the point. You all now are talking about legallities of minor's, and game's that allow minors to play in them.

What I saw in the video were a group of kid's, with very real looking weapons, allowed to run loose outdoors. What will happen after a few months of shooting each other while listening to C-Rap tune's about mindless violence, attacking other because they can(listen to that song)
What happens when these little punk, who alreal shoot the guns gangland style, and act real hard, get bored? What happens when they decide to pull a prank and go shoot people for fun and tape that for say MTV?
What will happen to airsoft gun availabilty when little kids like these get shot and killed for displaying or pointing the guns somewhere other than the backyard?
Somebody bought them those guns, and I didnt see any red barrals on them.

Is Doc Hollywood a real lawyer or a wanna-be? Hollywood, the basic fact here should not be who should be sue'd or if a field run's itself as an LLC, it should be striving for the formation of an airsoft society where only adults run thing and play, a airsoft group that controls how games are ran, and who can play. Police yourself, or others will do it for you.

And as that dude E-raq said, they are now celebrities, what will they do next for attention?

I know someone here teaches classes and allows kids to attend, that is dumbasses as hell, all this will do is give them more idea's of what to do next.

[Phreakish]

TEACHING is good, letting them run loose is the bad part... Hopefully while being taught, they LEARN something, but they still shouldn't have unrestricted access to their toys, and their use should be restricted to controlled environments (SUPERVISED BY ADEQUATE PARENTS).