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Offline SHIFTY1944

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« Reply #15 on: February 25, 2004, 02:58:52 PM »
Sept. will be an interesting month...I can't wait.Iam tired of all this pre ban/post ban BS.Its time to erase the Clinton legacy.
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 05:00:00 PM by SHIFTY1944 »

Offline Legs

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« Reply #16 on: February 25, 2004, 03:01:08 PM »
The gun show loophole is a term created by the Libs.  It's nothing more than Americans exercising their rights to gun ownership and transference.  It was dubbed a "loophole" when it was not included (by the LIBS) in any of their legislation aimed at registration, and therefore guns bought and sold at  gunshows "escaped registration."  How do I feel about it?  It's a beautiful thing.  Crooks don't go to gunshows to buy guns en masse.  Do a couple do so?  Probably.  But this is just one more ultra-hyped-up "problem" that does not exist.  Crooks also steal guns from the homes of law abiding citizens.  Shall we ban the storage of legally owned guns unless they are in controlled centralized lockboxes?  Oh wait...that's being done right now in the UK, Australia, Canada...
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 05:00:00 PM by Legs »
Molon labe
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Offline Harley

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« Reply #17 on: February 25, 2004, 03:24:44 PM »
<blockquote id="quote"><font size="1" face="Verdana" id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"><i>Originally posted by leakingpen</i>
<br />quick question, whats the general concensus around here on the "gun show loophole" ?
since everyones talking about the wonders of the awb sunsetting (im with raith, getting rid of a bad law thats only supposed to be temporary...  big deal)

also, i was under the impression that the second two were attached by republicans as a bribe to get dems to vote for the removal of liability from gun manufactureres.
<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote"></font id="quote">

The "gun show loophole" is a falacy.  What they're trying to do is make private sales illegal.  If I take my x brand gun to the show with me with a for sale sign on it and Joe Smith buys it from me that's a private sale.  The same thing I can do any day of the week by putting an ad in the paper or on one of these forums.  No paper work involved, no government involved.
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 05:00:00 PM by Harley »
\"Just because you\'re paranoid, doesn\'t mean they\'re not out to get you!\"

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Offline Raith

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« Reply #18 on: February 25, 2004, 03:55:08 PM »
<blockquote id="quote"><font size="1" face="Verdana" id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"><i>Originally posted by leakingpen</i>
<br />quick question, whats the general concensus around here on the "gun show loophole" ?<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote"></font id="quote">

There is no gun show loophole.  Private sales of firearms are subject to the same laws regarding any other private sale.  Most of the proposed laws regarding gun shows that I've seen (Like McCain's) have brough up serious First Amendment issues.

<blockquote id="quote"><font size="1" face="Verdana" id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">since everyones talking about the wonders of the awb sunsetting (im with raith, getting rid of a bad law thats only supposed to be temporary...  big deal)<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote"></font id="quote">

Thats not really my stance... My words are failing me here.  Let me try it one more time.

AWB sunsetting is important.  It does, however, fall short in comparison with what lies ahead and what else needs to be done.  Again, important, but not THE most important.  Success here is critical, but its only a step towards "retaking" lost ground.
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 05:00:00 PM by Raith »
Live free or die: Death is not the worst of evils.


Raven1

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« Reply #19 on: February 26, 2004, 08:47:14 AM »
It's a good thing people!

Kyle, Jason, Harley and the rest, I will be joining you soon as I purchase what I feel is neccessary ( and cool ) for personal protection as the prices drop.

Criminals are always going to have weapons and these types of laws usually hurt the law abiding citizen and not the criminals who break and ignore gun laws.

This is Huge!
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 05:00:00 PM by Raven1 »

Offline leakingpen

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« Reply #20 on: February 26, 2004, 10:16:33 AM »
okay, so quick question for those that know more than I on the subject.  Is there any kind of limits on how many weapons you sell before you move from private sales to a dealer?  Have been talking on the subject with a few friends, trying to make sure I have correct info.
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 05:00:00 PM by leakingpen »

Offline Legs

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« Reply #21 on: February 26, 2004, 10:48:58 AM »
I do not know the number, but yes there is a limit.  Same as cars.  You can only own so many cars and have them on your property before you need to declare yourself a dealer/collector/etc. and zoning can come into effect, and you can only sell so many in one month without having to declare yourself a dealer and having a license to sell in quantity.  Others here know more than I do specifically about this.
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 05:00:00 PM by Legs »
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Offline leakingpen

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« Reply #22 on: March 02, 2004, 11:05:26 AM »
http://story.news.yahoo.com/news?tmpl=s ... ess_guns_8


Senate OKs Assault Weapons Ban Extension
WASHINGTON - The Senate voted Tuesday to extend for another decade a ban on military-style assault weapons and to require background checks on buyers at private gun shows, giving Democrats rare victories on gun legislation that would also deny crime victims the ability to sue gunmakers and dealers
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 05:00:00 PM by leakingpen »

Offline Harley

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« Reply #23 on: March 02, 2004, 11:09:56 AM »
No big surprise here.  Expect the new extension to be worse people.
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 05:00:00 PM by Harley »
\"Just because you\'re paranoid, doesn\'t mean they\'re not out to get you!\"

\"Have Gun - Will Travel\"

Offline Harley

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« Reply #24 on: March 02, 2004, 11:31:45 AM »
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 05:00:00 PM by Harley »
\"Just because you\'re paranoid, doesn\'t mean they\'re not out to get you!\"

\"Have Gun - Will Travel\"

Offline Paco

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« Reply #25 on: March 02, 2004, 11:36:05 AM »
Yep - pretty sad, but remember...  this is just a vote to amend Fienstein's AWB extension to S 1805, so the AWB has NOT been extended as the article makes it sound.  The bill hasn't even been voted on yet.  Most knew that it would be amended in the Senate - no big surprise there.  However, if it's passed in the Senate (likely), it still has to be sent to the house.  It's pretty much a lock that it won't even be read on the House floor, and even if it were, there's nowhere near enough support to pass it there.  The CLEAN bill which is now S 1805, passed in the House by a vote of 277-140 (or something near that - very lopsided).  Tom Delay "The Hammer" has said repeatedly that he won't even bring the AWB up for a vote in the House - and it's his decision since he's the Majority Leader.

I'm still betting that the AWB will sunset in September this year.  Anyone want to take me up on a bet?  [;)]
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 05:00:00 PM by Paco »

Offline Paco

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« Reply #26 on: March 02, 2004, 12:02:03 PM »
If the liability bill is passed this afternoon, it will go to a conference committee wherein bipartisan representatives from the Senate and the House will negotiate as to revised versions that they think will pass their respective branches of the legislature (i.e., the House members will consider the House requirements, and the Senate will consider the Senate's). Ordinarily, new provisions are not to be permitted to be added to a bill in conference.

Provided that the conference committee can reach an agreement on a single bill, each portion of the committee (House and Senate representatives) will submit a report to their branches, and the conference bill will be submitted to a straight up-and-down vote. If it passes both houses, it will be presented to the President for his signature or veto.

The AW ban could be stripped in the conference committee, as could McCain's Gun Show amendment that has been added (yep - the one that bans PRIVATE SALES at gun shows).  I believe that the House leadership's stance on the AW ban will win out; politicians will understand that DeLay would not do a 180 degree turn (he can not, without losing face). But, this means that the other provisions (e.g., gun show language) may stay in, and the House may feel itself lucky if it can pass the liability and gun show provisions without the AW ban.

All politicians have two mutually reinforcing goals:

1. To remain in power; and,
2. To do favors for their friends.

The Dems have now done a favor for all the anti-gun groups out there. The Repubs have attempted to do a favor for the gun manufacturers and pro-gun groups, and this now hangs in the balance.

My prediction: The Senate Dems and 10 turncoat Repubs have effectively torpedoed the gun liability bill. If the gun show and AW language is not stripped, the House will not pass it. If that language is stripped, the Senate will not pass it.  Either way, the AW ban will not be renewed.
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 05:00:00 PM by Paco »

Offline Harley

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« Reply #27 on: March 02, 2004, 12:41:19 PM »
Paco, you're living in a fairytail world.  They'll pass it with flying colors and I dread what they'll add to it to make it worse. [:(]
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 05:00:00 PM by Harley »
\"Just because you\'re paranoid, doesn\'t mean they\'re not out to get you!\"

\"Have Gun - Will Travel\"

Offline Paco

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« Reply #28 on: March 02, 2004, 12:48:01 PM »
Harley...  wanna bet?  [:D]  I'll bet you one of my AR-15's against one of yours that the AWB sunsets in September as scheduled.
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 05:00:00 PM by Paco »

Offline Harley

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« Reply #29 on: March 02, 2004, 12:54:41 PM »
Very tempting offer, I may take you up on that.

My philosophy has always been to hope for the best but prepar for the worst.
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 05:00:00 PM by Harley »
\"Just because you\'re paranoid, doesn\'t mean they\'re not out to get you!\"

\"Have Gun - Will Travel\"