m4 firing problem in semi

[thunter]

Well i just had a new spring added to the gun and now the gun will shoot in full auto but in semi it will miss fire from time to time like every 5 or 6 times then when it does fire it only goes around 15 feet sometimes it will spit out 2 at a time i tried someone else's mag thinking it was the mag but was still doing it .I'm using a 9.6 battery a 110 spring and the rest is stock there is a 2 piece hop up and i just put in a scs hop up nub with the new tight bore. thank guys for reading and i appreciate all the feedback

[axisofoil]

Well i just had a new spring added to the gun and now the gun will shoot in full auto but in semi it will miss fire from time to time like every 5 or 6 times then when it does fire it only goes around 15 feet sometimes it will spit out 2 at a time i tried someone else's mag thinking it was the mag but was still doing it .I'm using a 9.6 battery a 110 spring and the rest is stock there is a 2 piece hop up and i just put in a scs hop up nub with the new tight bore. thank guys for reading and i appreciate all the feedback

The rest is stock what? Echo 1? kwa? jg?

[thunter]

dpms i took it over to gearbox they said it might be the seal it is only shooting 265 to 270 right now

[AE86_sr20]

take it apart and put it back together. practice makes perfect. is it shooting the full range when it's on full auto? or is it doing the same on semi?

[thunter]

my worry is i would not have up and running right by sat and i would miss a game that's why I'm looking for another one to put in then i could start to figure out how it works

[mondo90]

i worked on my m4 all summer and had a ton of problems and i finally got it all worked out. Did u put the spring in urself? what other new parts were added?

[War savage]

You need to take it apart again and make sure you intalled the gears along with the tappet plate correctly (timing is off). Make sure your tappet plate is not cracked or worn down. Make sure your springs for the anti rotation lever is in correctly. It sounds like the gears are continuing to rotate causing your piston to pull the nozzle back and double feed. There's a lot of steps to trouble shoot.

You need to sit down with lots of time and just check it out. Have you taken your gearbox apart before? You need to have a pretty solid memory and knowledge of how everything was when you took it apart. It's an issue that you need to put your hands on to figure out.

Sorry couldn't be more help. I would need to physically look at it. 90% of the time, these issues are solved by someone actually getting into it themselves and trouble shooting. Just takes time.

[Whiskey11]

You need to take it apart again and make sure you intalled the gears along with the tappet plate correctly (timing is off). Make sure your tappet plate is not cracked or worn down. Make sure your springs for the anti rotation lever is in correctly. It sounds like the gears are continuing to rotate causing your piston to pull the nozzle back and double feed. There's a lot of steps to trouble shoot.

You need to sit down with lots of time and just check it out. Have you taken your gearbox apart before? You need to have a pretty solid memory and knowledge of how everything was when you took it apart. It's an issue that you need to put your hands on to figure out.

Sorry couldn't be more help. I would need to physically look at it. 90% of the time, these issues are solved by someone actually getting into it themselves and trouble shooting. Just takes time.

Gearbox timing, the worlds biggest myth...  I'd just like to point out, that the only "timing" things that need to be done when reassembling a gearbox are to make sure that the tappet plate nub is not pulling back the tappet plate and that the sector gear's teeth are not touching the piston.  Thats it.  Irregardless of where the sector gear's teeth are on the piston, and saying that the piston could be pulled back an infinite distance and is still under spring release, the sector gear's first revolution is the only revolution that'd be "out of time" after the first cycle both systems reset and it would resume normal operation.  Setting the gears so that the sector gear's teeth are interacting (IE, 2nd tooth on sector gear touching first tooth of Piston) is a surefire way to destroy a gearset and/or piston, but 99% of people who manage to get a gearbox open and then close it again have enough common sense to know that, either accidentally or intentionally.  It's also very difficult to put a spring in a gearbox with thepiston partially pulled back, which may add to that "common sense" thing.

Double Feeding/not feeding/no range and FPS are very difficult to diagnose over the internet.  Double feeding is generally caused by the following:
-ARL is installed in correctly allowing the gears to rotate the oposite direction than the norm which causes the tappet plate to cycle twice (once when the piston was being pulled back the first time, then gearbox reset, and then the second time when the trigger is pulled again).
-Air nozzle is too short allowing a second BB to jump into the line of the airnozzle when the airnozzle is retracted.  (For lack of a better phrase, retarded return of the airnozzle can cause double feeding).  This problem may exist if the hop up unit is too far forward.
-Hop Up Rubber is torn or not seated correctly in hop up unit such that the lips on the end of the barrel are loose enough to not stop the first BB in the correct spot which allows a second BB to be fed and possibly more than 2 BB's.

The last point certainly is suspect because you have no FPS, that means that there is either a serious airleak in your gearbox reassembly (a possibility that has it's own consequences) and it explains the whole "no range" thing, but so does the lack of FPS.

[War savage]

You need to take it apart again and make sure you intalled the gears along with the tappet plate correctly (timing is off). Make sure your tappet plate is not cracked or worn down. Make sure your springs for the anti rotation lever is in correctly. It sounds like the gears are continuing to rotate causing your piston to pull the nozzle back and double feed. There's a lot of steps to trouble shoot.

You need to sit down with lots of time and just check it out. Have you taken your gearbox apart before? You need to have a pretty solid memory and knowledge of how everything was when you took it apart. It's an issue that you need to put your hands on to figure out.

Sorry couldn't be more help. I would need to physically look at it. 90% of the time, these issues are solved by someone actually getting into it themselves and trouble shooting. Just takes time.

Gearbox timing, the worlds biggest myth...  I'd just like to point out, that the only "timing" things that need to be done when reassembling a gearbox are to make sure that the tappet plate nub is not pulling back the tappet plate and that the sector gear's teeth are not touching the piston.  Thats it.  Irregardless of where the sector gear's...

Yes...I knew I would catch hell for saying "timing is off". Thats why it's in parenthases. Let me just say this. Speaking from experience, I once did install a new heavier spring, metal upgraded spring guide w/ball bearings and ball bearing piston head. The addition of the bearings caused the spring to compress itself so much it stopped the piston from retracting all the way back. Which in return stopped the "timing" of the piston to be released with the sector gear, causing damage to the piston. Also causing a drop in FPS due to lack of enough air entering the cylinder. Hence loss of FPS.

So to mention, "timing" is always something you may consider when checking overall function of a gearbox.

As I mentioned before. It's something that takes time to trouble shoot. Do check everything that was mentioned by Whiskey11. Along with the compression of the spring. If you added ball bearings to the piston head and spring guide, you could be further pre-loading your spring and stopping the piston from retracting causing bad "timing".

And one other note: Whiskey11. The use of the word "Irregardless". There is no such standard word as "irregardless"... it is simply "regardless". The origin of irregardless is not known for certain, but the speculation among references is that it may be a blend, or portmanteau word, of irrespective and regardless, both of which are commonly accepted standard English words. By blending these words, an illogical word is created. The nonstandard word irregardless is redundant. It is a double negative. The prefix ir- means not. People intend irregardless to mean without regard for some information, or without taking certain information into consideration. But it would really mean "Not [ir-] without regard" [regardless].
When used, the word irregardless carries the unfortunate sense that an uninformed person is attempting to appear learned. Regardless of what others may say, avoid "irregardless".

[axisofoil]

Yes...I knew I would catch hell for saying "timing is off". Thats why it's in parenthases. Let me just say this. Speaking from experience, I once did install a new, heavier spring, metal upgraded spring guide w/ball bearings and ball bearing piston head. The addition of the bearings caused the spring to compress itself so much that it stopped the piston from retracting all the way back. Which in return stopped the "timing" of the piston to be released with the sector gear, causing damage to the piston. Also causing a drop in FPS due to lack of enough air entering the cylinder. Hence loss of FPS.

So to mention, "timing" is always something you may consider when checking overall function of a gearbox.

As I mentioned before. It's something that takes time to trouble shoot. Do check everything that was mentioned by Whiskey11. Along with the compression of the spring. If you added ball bearings to the piston head and spring guide, you could be further pre-loading your spring and stopping the piston from retracting causing bad "timing".

And one other note: Whiskey11. The use of the word "Irregardless". There is no such standard word as "irregardless"... it is simply "regardless". The origin of irregardless is not known for certain, but the speculation among references is that it may be a blend, or portmanteau word, of irrespective and regardless, both of which are commonly accepted, standard English words. By blending these words, an illogical word is created. The nonstandard word irregardless is redundant. It is a double negative. The prefix ir- means not. People intend irregardless to mean without regard for some information, or without taking certain information into consideration. But it would really mean "Not [ir-] without regard" [regardless].
When used, the word irregardless carries the unfortunate sense that an uninformed person is attempting to appear learned. Regardless of what others may say, avoid "irregardless".

Watch your grammar.
And, what you're saying as far as your gearbox locking up makes no sense to me. It sounds more like your motor wasn't able to compress the spring all the way or that you put your gearbox together with the sector gear engaged with the piston already, not a problem with 'Timing' of a sector gear and tappet plate.

[War savage]

axisofoil

Watch your grammar.
And, what you're saying as far as your gearbox locking up makes no sense to me. It sounds more like your motor wasn't able to compress the spring all the way or that you put your gearbox together with the sector gear engaged with the piston already, not a problem with 'Timing' of a sector gear and tappet plate.

Ha, ha! +1 axisofoil. Ya got me!  =D>

You have to follow along while reading. There was never mention of the gearbox locking up. There was and still is plenty of juice and torque to compress the spring back. The damage to the piston was stripped teeth. Which also can contribute to a loss of FPS. Trust me I can tear down my AEG within minutes and find any problems with it. "Regardless", that's in the past and it's not my AEG that's in question.

Lets help our friend solve his problem with his.  

[Whiskey11]

You need to take it apart again and make sure you intalled the gears along with the tappet plate correctly (timing is off). Make sure your tappet plate is not cracked or worn down. Make sure your springs for the anti rotation lever is in correctly. It sounds like the gears are continuing to rotate causing your piston to pull the nozzle back and double feed. There's a lot of steps to trouble shoot.

You need to sit down with lots of time and just check it out. Have you taken your gearbox apart before? You need to have a pretty solid memory and knowledge of how everything was when you took it apart. It's an issue that you need to put your hands on to figure out.

Sorry couldn't be more help. I would need to physically look at it. 90% of the time, these issues are solved by someone actually getting into it themselves and trouble shooting. Just takes time.

Gearbox timing, the worlds biggest myth...  I'd just like to point out, that the only "timing" things that need to be done when reassembling a gearbox are to make sure that the tappet plate nub is not pulling back the tappet plate and that the sector gear's teeth are not touching the piston.  Thats it.  Irregardless of where the sector gear's...

Yes...I knew I would catch hell for saying "timing is off". Thats why it's in parenthases. Let me just say this. Speaking from experience, I once did install a new heavier spring, metal upgraded spring guide w/ball bearings and ball bearing piston head. The addition of the bearings caused the spring to compress itself so much it stopped the piston from retracting all the way back. Which in return stopped the "timing" of the piston to be released with the sector gear, causing damage to the piston. Also causing a drop in FPS due to lack of enough air entering the cylinder. Hence loss of FPS.

So to mention, "timing" is always something you may consider when checking overall function of a gearbox.

As I mentioned before. It's something that takes time to trouble shoot. Do check everything that was mentioned by Whiskey11. Along with the compression of the spring. If you added ball bearings to the piston head and spring guide, you could be further pre-loading your spring and stopping the piston from retracting causing bad "timing".

And one other note: Whiskey11. The use of the word "Irregardless". There is no such standard word as "irregardless"... it is simply "regardless". The origin of irregardless is not known for certain, but the speculation among references is that it may be a blend, or portmanteau word, of irrespective and regardless, both of which are commonly accepted standard English words. By blending these words, an illogical word is created. The nonstandard word irregardless is redundant. It is a double negative. The prefix ir- means not. People intend irregardless to mean without regard for some information, or without taking certain information into consideration. But it would really mean "Not [ir-] without regard" [regardless].
When used, the word irregardless carries the unfortunate sense that an uninformed person is attempting to appear learned. Regardless of what others may say, avoid "irregardless".

Grammar nazi  :roll:

Stripping a piston is not what I'd consider a "timing" error.  We are not talking about timing on an engine's cam chain, we are talking about a self reseting system everytime it cycles.  If you stripped your piston because the overcompression of a spring thats not the fault of the gears meshing poorly or "out of time" it's a mechanical stop and something has to give and that is intentionally the piston especially since the motor had enough overall power to rip through the piston.

Personally, from experience, Bearing piston heads and bearing spring guides used together is a recipe for disaster and overly redundent.  If you are worried about scaring the inside of your piston head place one of the solid metal plates from the bearing spring guide, but any quality aftermarket spring is going to have ground down ends to be flat, any rotation of that spring is going to have to overcome static friction on the piston head's end.  Being as energies are a lot like water in that they take the path of least resistance, a bearing piston head is more than adequate at releasing a springs rotational tension and stress, no use putting them on both ends.  I personally destroyed (and I have a picture to prove it ) a G&G reinforced piston, not that I believe it's reinforced, but the combination of a Guarder SP130 (Inch and change longer than the stock spring) and 6mm of Sorbo and bearing spring guide and piston head took the entire front of the piston and shattereted it clean off, metal rack and all



Lesson learned, no using bearing spring guides and piston heads with Sorbo to correct AoE and long springs... it is premature piston failure waiting to happen!