Airsoft Arizona
Airsoft Hardware => Accessories & Gear => Topic started by: AgentP on February 21, 2010, 01:10:34 AM
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I've been seeing a lot of people on the field/internet with some form or another of digital camo. I was wanting to do a desert scheme but I was curious to find out if the military used a certain palette because it concealed better or if you could just choose whatever you want as long as it looks cool because it all has the same effect.
Input?
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I've been seeing a lot of people on the field/internet with some form or another of digital camo. I was wanting to do a desert scheme but I was curious to find out if the military used a certain palette because it concealed better or if you could just choose whatever you want as long as it looks cool because it all has the same effect.
Input?
Army uses ACU colors because they're cheap I imagine. And because they work well in burning buildings/extremely urban environments.
Marpat is used because it's useful and effective in woods and desert (depending on which marpat you're talking about)
Digital camo looks futuristic and intimidating. Whether or not it is effective at concealment, it adds a certain awe factor to any military unit. For MOST airsoft purposes, you won't notice a difference between camo patterns, although if you're doing far and away sneaking for an uber flank, it can help, in which case it needs to be paired to your environment and the rest of your gear. Multicam tends to be good all around (it IS what it was designed for, after all). ACU tends to suck in camo factor, but it looks cool. Marpat works in the environment it was intended for (temperate woodlands or desert)... but is bad in any other scenario. You might look like a sand-dune trying to blend into a tree, for instance.
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My personal opinion on desert digital is that it works 'best' in the desert. But then again I don't think camouflage matters much. Bob, wearing green, can preform just as good as Joe, wearing tan, in the desert. I don't actually have a digital uniform, but those I do seeing wearing it (Compared to others wearing different desert camo patterns) seem to camouflage slightly better into the terrain.
I prefer multicam though.
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I think digital patterns don't really make a difference as far as concealment is concerned, specially at the ranges that most games in phoenix are played. I personally like the look of digital patterns so i wear them (when i can afford to buy them). If you do choose to get a digital pattern go with MarPat. They are easily distinguishable between green and tan.
On a side note, if your planning a new kit avoid black as much as possible. Many people buy black vests, holsters or pouches for one reason or another. In my opinion black items on your kit amplify the body's shape which undermines the whole idea behind camo in the first place.
... Army uses ACU colors because they're cheap I imagine. And because they work well in burning buildings/extremely urban environments. ...
lol. I cant wait to get my ACUs just so i can wear them around you... then pull you out of an extremely urban, burning building ;) You wont even see my coming.
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I've been seeing a lot of people on the field/internet with some form or another of digital camo. I was wanting to do a desert scheme but I was curious to find out if the military used a certain palette because it concealed better or if you could just choose whatever you want as long as it looks cool because it all has the same effect.
Input?
Choose what you like.
UCP, the pattern used for the ACU, is being replaced in OEF by MultiCam because it has been found to be an inferior pattern for multiple environments.
If I were to spend my own money on some digital uniforms, I'd go for the TRU from tru spec, one woodland digital, one desert digital.
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If I were to spend my own money on some digital uniforms, I'd go for the TRU from tru spec, one woodland digital, one desert digital.
+1 on the two uniforms. It's going to allow you to choose what side of a MilSim you want to play. Usually mil sims are green vs tan.
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Check out the CADPAT camo as well. They are a ripoff of the Marine Corps' MARPAT but they use slightly different colors for their woodland and desert uniforms. Nevertheless it is still effective and with the CADPAT you would definately have a unique look.
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Check out the CADPAT camo as well. They are a ripoff of the Marine Corps' MARPAT but they use slightly different colors for their woodland and desert uniforms. Nevertheless it is still effective and with the CADPAT you would definately have a unique look.
CADPAT is a Canadian pattern. It's not a rip off of MARPAT, although MARPAT is very effective in a woodland or desert setting.
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MARPAT is actually a rip-off of CADPAT http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/MARPAT.
Regarldess, I was more asking if a certain combination of specific colors for a certain theme (desert,woodland) was more effective than others.
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black does that because it is not a natural color, you will not find the color black in nature
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The Marines came up with the MARPAT design in late 2000. They were looking for a new pattern, a more effective pattern. Because of it's success the Army developed their own digital camo, the ACU pattern. The Air Force followed suit and designed a combination of tiger stripe and ACU. The Navy simply uses a combination of greys to compliment their digital pattern. The Canadians copied the idea but not the exact pattern. There are a couple of other countries that have adopted the digital pattern but the USMC was first. Just to set the record strait.
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The Marines came up with the MARPAT design in late 2000. They were looking for a new pattern, a more effective pattern. Because of it's success the Army developed their own digital camo, the ACU pattern. The Air Force followed suit and designed a combination of tiger stripe and ACU. The Navy simply uses a combination of greys to compliment their digital pattern. The Canadians copied the idea but not the exact pattern. There are a couple of other countries that have adopted the digital pattern but the USMC was first. Just to set the record strait.
All that stuff is pretty inferior to A-TACS anyways. And in case you have been living in a closet, the US Army Finally announced the arrival of MC.
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The standard camo for any ground troop is USUALLY acu. it is designed to give you a decent blend with any terrain/weather. however, we are in arizona, and all we have is dirt, so i would go with some desert. BUT, if you wanna have some good camo for where ever you may find your self airsofting, acu would be best.
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The standard camo for any ground troop is USUALLY acu. it is designed to give you a decent blend with any terrain/weather. however, we are in arizona, and all we have is dirt, so i would go with some desert. BUT, if you wanna have some good camo for where ever you may find your self airsofting, acu would be best.
You are very very wrong. ACU barely helps in any environment, including desert <-- That's what you got right, is that ACU doesn't work in the desert.
That's why, as this thread states, the Army has switched/is in the process of switching to MultiCam already. ACU is quite simply awful in most cases.
If you want good camo for wherever you may find yourself airsofting, MultiCam is readily available and respectable in most terrains. a-tacs would be a great choice if you can find it.
and an invisibility cloak would be the sh!+.
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Has anyone seen the new camo the Brits are wearing. That seems to be pretty effective in multipul environments. Can't remember what it's called tho
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If you want good camo for wherever you may find yourself airsofting, MultiCam is readily available and respectable in most terrains. a-tacs would be a great choice if you can find it.
I called on the A-tacs they will be out this fall they were just shown for the first time at the gun show this January but you can order them right know from them they are from south Carolina
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guess i was wrong! just tellin him what i thought was right. i apologize.
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guess i was wrong! just tellin him what i thought was right. i apologize.
We've all been there man. If you think ACU is awesome... I've got a set I'd be more than happy to sell you. lol.
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CADPAT was adopted before MARPAT. That is a fact.
UCP, the pattern fround on the ACU, was derived from MARPAT, in a palette of colors that would be universal for most battlefield environments and allow for a single uniform.
MultiCam was developed by Caleb Crye, with funding from Natick, for the Army's Future Force Warrior program. This pattern is now being adopted by all soldiers in the OEF theater of operations only, for now.
There is alot of misinformation in this thread. The above should clear that up.
Do not post information that you do not have first hand, empirical knowledge of.
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Personally i find that the Digital Woodland works well in the desert and the woodland area's of town. but when it comes down to it all its your personal prefrence of the type you want
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Stealth camo is the best, some MGS action if you know what I mean. Just call me solid snake :mrgreen:
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guess i was wrong! just tellin him what i thought was right. i apologize.
We've all been there man. If you think ACU is awesome... I've got a set I'd be more than happy to sell you. lol.
no thanks man. got a set of woodland and acu. thank you though! see ya round!
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heres the next best thing until the atacs become available this fall...
(http://www.opsgear.com/common/images/products/large/ATL-1265_03_lg.jpg)
(http://www.opsgear.com/common/images/products/large/ATL-1265_04_lg.jpg)
(http://www.opsgear.com/common/images/products/large/ATL-1265_05_lg.jpg)
(http://www.opsgear.com/common/images/products/large/ATL-1265_06_lg.jpg)
(http://www.opsgear.com/common/images/products/large/ATL-1265_07_lg.jpg)
(http://www.opsgear.com/common/images/products/large/ATL-1265_09_lg.jpg)
The tru-spec MCs...
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Those are cool pics. Definately changed my view of Multicam
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Those are cool pics. Definately changed my view of Multicam
thats what i said... :-s but a full uniform is ganna set u back a cool $142 for the tops and bottom but would be well worth it...im ganna get em as soon as i can save up some cash...
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Those are cool pics. Definately changed my view of Multicam
thats what i said... :-s but a full uniform is ganna set u back a cool $142 for the tops and bottom but would be well worth it...im ganna get em as soon as i can save up some cash...
multisham from ehobby is nearly as effective... and has some other nicer features like super reinforced elbows and such.
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Those are cool pics. Definately changed my view of Multicam
thats what i said... :-s but a full uniform is ganna set u back a cool $142 for the tops and bottom but would be well worth it...im ganna get em as soon as i can save up some cash...
Genuine Multicam can be had for much less then 140 for top and bottom. uniforms in this pattern cause the priceto vary, different uniform cuts and material can make the uniforms can either rise or lower the cost.
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Those are cool pics. Definately changed my view of Multicam
thats what i said... :-s but a full uniform is ganna set u back a cool $142 for the tops and bottom but would be well worth it...im ganna get em as soon as i can save up some cash...
multisham from ehobby is nearly as effective... and has some other nicer features like super reinforced elbows and such.
do you see these man... :shock: lol
(http://www.opsgear.com/common/images/products/large/ATL-1265_01_lg.jpg)
the're amazing =P~ lol
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I have Tru Spec Multicam tops and bottoms, which cost me around $110 covering tax.
I'm a big fan of Multicam, but at the same time, it's not the most effective for AZ environments. It's not horrible, it just has more green than most parts of the desert. I still use though, and I manage to pull of sneaky feet. ;)
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Saint"]I have Tru Spec Multicam tops and bottoms, which cost me around $110 covering tax.
I'm a big fan of Multicam, but at the same time, it's not the most effective for AZ environments. It's not horrible, it just has more green than most parts of the desert. I still use though, and I manage to pull of sneaky feet. ;)
nice to know...
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eh Multi-clone. I remember when this pattern came out. Every one had to have it so it made organizing events hard. It's not a bad pattern though. I suspect that after A-Tacs comes out the price on this patter will drop substantially along with ACU. Marpat doesn't seem to fluctuate very much though.
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eh Multi-clone. I remember when this pattern came out. Every one had to have it so it made organizing events hard. It's not a bad pattern though. I suspect that after A-Tacs comes out the price on this patter will drop substantially along with ACU. Marpat doesn't seem to fluctuate very much though.
ACU has been rock-bottom pricing wise for a long time.
It will get even cheaper soon as it is phased out of the Army though. Like Woodland. Because there are massive stores of it at the manufacturers'... and they gotta get rid of it.
Military issue camo is generally cheaper, as it can then be had secondhand from the guys who serve in a desk-job capacity and never end up putting real wear and tear on it, and then get out while they can. As well as wrong-sizes, etc... not to mention the huge amount of orders (more people buying it means less cost to make it).
Multicam will get cheaper soon, I doubt it will be because of A-Tacs though.
And the multisham/multiclone has come a long way. Some of it (like the stuff off ehobby), is pretty good. Some is still downright awful though. lol.
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Keep it professional guys.
I do think that UCP has it's difficulties, it looks better when it is faded and dirty, but most patterns do too.
It is a tall order to make a camo pattern that will work everywhere, even multicam has difficulty sometimes.
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I think some MultiCam might get a bit harder to find soon, especially the uniforms by Crye.
I don't understand why you guys think ATACS is so fantastic, considering none of you have seen it in person. I also don't think any of you are aware of the fact that Multicam is about to outfit entire BDEs in OEF.
Again, keep your posts within the realm of your first hand knowledge.
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I think some MultiCam might get a bit harder to find soon, especially the uniforms by Crye.
I don't understand why you guys think ATACS is so fantastic, considering none of you have seen it in person. I also don't think any of you are aware of the fact that Multicam is about to outfit entire BDEs in OEF.
Again, keep your posts within the realm of your first hand knowledge.
i cant speak for any1 else but i was 100% aware of the MCs issue to the soldiers of OEF and was my reason for putting the pictures of them up on here. i like to see the great side by side of the MCs next to the woodland...and for the ATACS they just look good but these are a great alternative that are about to become legitimate... :twisted:
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I was issued the first TRU's when they came out, the gay ones with the "Army Strong" logo in the center while in country, then on my last tour we got MC a few months before we left, and had already gotten the TRU's minus the logo, as well as plate carriers. We swapped out for plate carriers 2 months into the tour. MC's not a "Brand New" issue, PEO had kicked out some to some Civil Affairs units and Humint Units. EOD was also sporting some as far back as Feb 09. Of course the Army's got a crap load of uniforms in service from patrols wearing tank suits to Tan Flight Suits. Its still as patch worked as it was in 04 where some of us had BDU, some DBU, Some MICH's some ACH's, some with black boots and some with deserts. I stopped keeping track, I know the ACU's UC pattern sorta worked, if you're laying on or hiding amongst gravel, but its not about not being seen now, pretty much who see's who first and who brings the most guns and people. Camo doesn't amount for much when you have Air Support with thermals and BFT, I'll already know where you are, and We'll want you to know we're coming.
I think some MultiCam might get a bit harder to find soon, especially the uniforms by Crye.
I don't understand why you guys think ATACS is so fantastic, considering none of you have seen it in person. I also don't think any of you are aware of the fact that Multicam is about to outfit entire BDEs in OEF.
Again, keep your posts within the realm of your first hand knowledge.
i cant speak for any1 else but i was 100% aware of the MCs issue to the soldiers of OEF and was my reason for putting the pictures of them up on here. i like to see the great side by side of the MCs next to the woodland...and for the ATACS they just look good but these are a great alternative that are about to become legitimate... :twisted:
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This was a comparison we did a long time ago. I know Raith has the picture somewhere, if he doesn't repost it I will post the copy I have.
viewtopic.php?f=6&t=6088&st=0&sk=t&sd=a&hilit=comparison (http://airsoftarizona.com/forumbb/viewtopic.php?f=6&t=6088&st=0&sk=t&sd=a&hilit=comparison)
A lot of comparisons can be had by just googling "camo comparison" and looking at the image results.
Many of them are area specific. Woodland may work really well in the south but ACU may look better where it is dry, and so forth...
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This was a comparison we did a long time ago. I know Raith has the picture somewhere, if he doesn't repost it I will post the copy I have.
Here is the photo -
(http://i44.photobucket.com/albums/f36/castle-bravo/gearphotos/camocomparison.jpg)
This photo was probably taken in early 2005. Also noteworthy is the building in the background is the house at Four Peaks that is no longer there.
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wow...great photo! =D>
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Just noticed the Army Times had a big thing on ACU's will be going to multicam and found out they're already showing up on PBIS, so our unit supply can order them. F*cking sweet, now I can get em for free.
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Just noticed the Army Times had a big thing on ACU's will be going to multicam and found out they're already showing up on PBIS, so our unit supply can order them. F*cking sweet, now I can get em for free.
hook up the hook up hommie...lol jk...they do look sweet...thats why they are switching over to em...
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On a side note, if your planning a new kit avoid black as much as possible. Many people buy black vests, holsters or pouches for one reason or another. In my opinion black items on your kit amplify the body's shape which undermines the whole idea behind camo in the first place.
Utter nonsense.
Black is the official color of ninjas, and I never see a ninja coming.
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I was issued the first TRU's when they came out, the gay ones with the "Army Strong" logo in the center while in country, then on my last tour we got MC a few months before we left, and had already gotten the TRU's minus the logo, as well as plate carriers. We swapped out for plate carriers 2 months into the tour. MC's not a "Brand New" issue, PEO had kicked out some to some Civil Affairs units and Humint Units. EOD was also sporting some as far back as Feb 09. Of course the Army's got a crap load of uniforms in service from patrols wearing tank suits to Tan Flight Suits. Its still as patch worked as it was in 04 where some of us had BDU, some DBU, Some MICH's some ACH's, some with black boots and some with deserts. I stopped keeping track, I know the ACU's UC pattern sorta worked, if you're laying on or hiding amongst gravel, but its not about not being seen now, pretty much who see's who first and who brings the most guns and people. Camo doesn't amount for much when you have Air Support with thermals and BFT, I'll already know where you are, and We'll want you to know we're coming.
I think some MultiCam might get a bit harder to find soon, especially the uniforms by Crye.
I don't understand why you guys think ATACS is so fantastic, considering none of you have seen it in person. I also don't think any of you are aware of the fact that Multicam is about to outfit entire BDEs in OEF.
Again, keep your posts within the realm of your first hand knowledge.
i cant speak for any1 else but i was 100% aware of the MCs issue to the soldiers of OEF and was my reason for putting the pictures of them up on here. i like to see the great side by side of the MCs next to the woodland...and for the ATACS they just look good but these are a great alternative that are about to become legitimate... :twisted:
I think you are mistaking the TRU for the ACS, which is what has the Army Strong logo centered on the chest.
As for when MC was first fielded, It was around during my OEF tour in 07. Among the SOF units I traveled with, at certain spots, there was a mix of Crye uniforms and TRUs. I got the latter. Keep in mind that what Big Army is getting from PEO Soldier is not at all a representation of the equipment available to all troops. The fact that it has been issued a NIIN does not mean it will be available to any admin guy with FedLog access.
As for air assets with "thermals"; something has to keeps the sac warm and dry during those cold Bagram winters! :lol:
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I was issued the first TRU's when they came out, the gay ones with the "Army Strong" logo in the center while in country, then on my last tour we got MC a few months before we left, and had already gotten the TRU's minus the logo, as well as plate carriers. We swapped out for plate carriers 2 months into the tour. MC's not a "Brand New" issue, PEO had kicked out some to some Civil Affairs units and Humint Units. EOD was also sporting some as far back as Feb 09. Of course the Army's got a crap load of uniforms in service from patrols wearing tank suits to Tan Flight Suits. Its still as patch worked as it was in 04 where some of us had BDU, some DBU, Some MICH's some ACH's, some with black boots and some with deserts. I stopped keeping track, I know the ACU's UC pattern sorta worked, if you're laying on or hiding amongst gravel, but its not about not being seen now, pretty much who see's who first and who brings the most guns and people. Camo doesn't amount for much when you have Air Support with thermals and BFT, I'll already know where you are, and We'll want you to know we're coming.
I think some MultiCam might get a bit harder to find soon, especially the uniforms by Crye.
I don't understand why you guys think ATACS is so fantastic, considering none of you have seen it in person. I also don't think any of you are aware of the fact that Multicam is about to outfit entire BDEs in OEF.
Again, keep your posts within the realm of your first hand knowledge.
i cant speak for any1 else but i was 100% aware of the MCs issue to the soldiers of OEF and was my reason for putting the pictures of them up on here. i like to see the great side by side of the MCs next to the woodland...and for the ATACS they just look good but these are a great alternative that are about to become legitimate... :twisted:
I think you are mistaking the TRU for the ACS, which is what has the Army Strong logo centered on the chest.
As for when MC was first fielded, It was around during my OEF tour in 07. Among the SOF units I traveled with, at certain spots, there was a mix of Crye uniforms and TRUs. I got the latter. Keep in mind that what Big Army is getting from PEO Soldier is not at all a representation of the equipment available to all troops. The fact that it has been issued a NIIN does not mean it will be available to any admin guy with FedLog access.
As for air assets with "thermals"; something has to keeps the sac warm and dry during those cold Bagram winters! :lol:
I noticed PEO always favors the paoj units, Like BDE HHC's and PA's. While us grunts got screwed into crappy nomex flight suits as a hot weather uniform. As for the TRU's and ACS's we had both. The gay ones with the logo. There were actually two versions of that one. Both had the logo. One had a jacked up "heat" venting pading on the upper chest area, that really was just a sweat sponge, and one with just t-shirt material on the chest. We got one of each, and those were worn out and stained by 3 months of wear, we were then issued 2 of the ACS's with no logo and only T-shirt material on the chest. That was near the end of 07 going into 08. This last tour 08-09, we got 4 of the ACS, with Nomex acu bottoms, all in modified ucp for Afghanistan. Now I guess thats killed since we're going to multicam. Which i like. As for hooking you up? We'll see..there's seems to be a shortage...wonder why.
Funny thing, I remember in 06 seeing a "storming normandy" video for the FCS Soldier system, they were wearing multicam acs, plate carriers with rifle blocks, and ACH's with the "new" rail mount system (that just now became available for open market). Someone who was watching the video with me commented, "why don't we have that shit" and i remember saying
"Give them about 4 or 5 years"
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On a side note, if your planning a new kit avoid black as much as possible. Many people buy black vests, holsters or pouches for one reason or another. In my opinion black items on your kit amplify the body's shape which undermines the whole idea behind camo in the first place.
Utter nonsense.
Black is the official color of ninjas, and I never see a ninja coming.
Black is becoming more popular as a color as guys are going more and more retro with gear, mindset and training. Also people seem to think that black will be some kind of gleaming light on the field, it will not, but your pit stained wifebeater is.
Being sneaky on the field has less to do with the camo you wear and more about your behavior, I got pluged in the back by a guy with a T-shirt and a maskingtape holster for his shotty because I was too focused on what was in front of me to look around.
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On a side note, if your planning a new kit avoid black as much as possible. Many people buy black vests, holsters or pouches for one reason or another. In my opinion black items on your kit amplify the body's shape which undermines the whole idea behind camo in the first place.
Utter nonsense.
Black is the official color of ninjas, and I never see a ninja coming.
Black is becoming more popular as a color as guys are going more and more retro with gear, mindset and training. Also people seem to think that black will be some kind of gleaming light on the field, it will not, but your pit stained wifebeater is.
Being sneaky on the field has less to do with the camo you wear and more about your behavior, I got pluged in the back by a guy with a T-shirt and a maskingtape holster for his shotty because I was too focused on what was in front of me to look around.
Tunnel vision is always a killer.
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Something to consider also with the digital cammies is that the digital pattern was designed to mess with digital cameras. The pixillated pattern is designed to help the user blend into the background better on intelligence photos and such when the resolution is lower and the picture is more grainy. For example take a display pic and blow it up to full screen, digital patterns are designed to blend in with this.
Also a note on camo, color matters less then shade. For example what is going to do better, dark woodlands or the lighter desert cammies when you are trying to hide behind shrubs and brush. Yes desert is designed to go with desert play, but what are you hiding behind? I know generally I am not prone trying to take cover behind the dirt, I am working the brush.
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Something to consider also with the digital cammies is that the digital pattern was designed to mess with digital cameras. The pixillated pattern is designed to help the user blend into the background better on intelligence photos and such when the resolution is lower and the picture is more grainy. For example take a display pic and blow it up to full screen, digital patterns are designed to blend in with this.
Also a note on camo, color matters less then shade. For example what is going to do better, dark woodlands or the lighter desert cammies when you are trying to hide behind shrubs and brush. Yes desert is designed to go with desert play, but what are you hiding behind? I know generally I am not prone trying to take cover behind the dirt, I am working the brush.
It was really more geared towards breaking up the silhouette of a group or stack of soldiers at a distance not so much an individual, more so during night ops.
And for the ninja thing....any ninja fan will tell you there was never ever ever any ninjas dressed in black garb in the days of the ninja. They typically wore blue or purple, as true black does not exist in nature.