Airsoft Arizona

Airsoft Hardware => Accessories & Gear => Topic started by: Raith on July 28, 2006, 07:19:17 PM

Title: Gear & YOU: Working Towards A Better Future (TM)
Post by: Raith on July 28, 2006, 07:19:17 PM
Recently, I was asked a few questions about gear - "How do you have your setup, what do you carry, etc, etc..." In an effort to consolidate some of this information in one place and give others something to consider, I decided to write some of my thoughts down. I'm not an expert by any means, but I have spent a considerable amount of time thinking about my gear setup, learning about whats available, and through trial and error, deciding what setup works best for me.

A lot of this relates to more of the big game mentality, rather than small local games, but the way I see it, we've moved into a pattern of attending a big game every six months or so, and I find that more or less everything in between is filler for me to figure out what I'm doing wrong so that I don't do it at the big games.

-----

I could categorize my approach to gear as an ideology rather than a specific pattern. I am constantly asking myself "How can I do this faster, lighter, and better?" It comes down to carrying what you need with little to no excess in such a way that it is easy for you to manipulate it and have fun.

I consider everything I carry to be essential to the way I play airsoft.  Several times, I've seen people at big games remove some of their gear for the Sunday portion of the game.  I've always wondered why they didn't get their stuff squared away before they even showed up.  I cannot dump any part of my gear and still function in the way that I'd like to.  I don't think anyone really carries stuff they don't use or don't intend to possibly use, but I do think that some people carry stuff that is unlikely to be used.

For example, I used to carry a medical pouch with a snake bite kit, an eye patch, one of those instant cold packs, etc. In retrospect, if I need an eye patch, I probably can't keep playing airsoft that day.  Now all I carry is bandaids, electrolytes, aspirin, and the like. Stuff that could deal with problems that would make me more comfortable if something did happen but didn't prevent me from continuing to play airsoft. I also used to have a flashlight, multitool, and compass in my utility pouches, but found that I never used them. Maybe in the future, I'll run across a situation where I decide to carry a multitool and flashlight again.

The key is finding out what works for you. What works for me may not be the same as what you need. Unfortunately, sometimes the process of discovering these things can be time consuming and expensive. Trial and error is really the only sure way. Your gear should work for you, not against you. I find that if everything is working correctly, I don't even think about it. If I keep thinking, "This radio antenna is poking me," that means I need to do something about it so that its not a problem anymore.

I see and hear other people talk about how they're putting up with this or making due with that or fighting with their gear in some fashion. You shouldn't have to do this. You don't have to "make due" or "put up" with anything. We are fortunate to have various people here that can sew up just about anything you could want.

Overall, I think what you carry can be broken down into 3 major categories -

1 - Ammunition (Magazines & Reloading Capability)
2 - Hydration (Water)
3 - Communications (Radio)

-----

Ammunition (Magazines & Reloading) -

Number of magazines -

Before I really started to think about what I was doing, I carried 13 magazines; 12 in my gear and 1 in the weapon. 12 on my rig seemed like a nice round number that allowed me plenty of mags and at the time, I didn't think it took up too much space or weighed too much. I did not carry any reloading capability.

I began to notice that I rarely ran through even half of those 13 magazines in any given situation. In late 2003, with the introduction of the pistol mag loader, battlefield reloading of standard magazines became a possibility and I started to consider that perhaps I could carry less magazines and some of the loaders. So I decided that instead of carrying 13 magazines, I'd reduce it to 9 mags. 8 in my gear and 1 in my weapon.

I now carry six pistol mag loaders. They each carry about 100 BBs and six of them gives me about 600 additional BBs. So with six loaders, I can reload all my magazines about once. My immediately available ammunition is lower than what I used to carry, (585 vs 845) but my overall capacity is at least doubled by the BBs in my loaders plus whatever additional bag of BBs I'm carrying. I also often carry a bag of extra BBs. 600 extra BBs in a bag takes up very little room. 1200 and 1800 aren't very much room either, so an effective triple or quadruple basic load isn't out of the question. A folded bag with a rubber band on it makes very little noise if stowed properly. Any noise that the pistol mag loaders make is reduced by being inside of my utility pouch.

Mag Pouches -

I like dual magazine pouches. Some people like single pouches and some like triple mag pouches as well. I feel that I can go prone, which doesn't happen that often, on a dual stack of M4 magazines with no problem. I prefer mag pouches with velcro closures. I think that gives the best compromise between speed and retention.

I put my magazines into mag pouches with the spine of the magazine to the left. (Sometimes called "Bullets forward") When I grab the magazine with my left hand, it is in the correct position to twist my hand around and insert the magazine with the least amount of movement.

When I draw a magazine, it is always from the same location on the left, unless I'm engaged in an extended firefight where I've gone through several of my magazines with a chance to replenish/replace and top off my magazines.

Reloading Magazines -

An emergency reload is reloading your magazine when you have to - it is empty; a tactical reload is a reload when you want to - partially empty. I never used to do any sort of tactical reloads and would just run my mags until they were dry and then reload. I don't do a tactical reload all the time now, and its something I've only recently incorporated into the way I manage my magazines. I mention it here because of the way it affects my gear setup. With the pistol mag loaders, I can now "top off" magazines that I've ditched before they were completely expended.

I try to have a good idea of what I've got in a magazine at any given time, but trying to count rounds is not a good idea. If I can't recall whats in it, I change it out. Next chance I get, I'll be back up to full capacity anyways.

I always try and complete several tasks during any downtime.

1) Drink water.

2) Put a full magazine in my weapon.

3) Move loaded magazines from right side pouches into empty left side pouches. (If necessary)

4) Remove any magazines in my dump pouch and replace them into the right side mag pouches to "go silent" again.

5) Replenish completely empty magazines.

6) Replenish partially empty magazines.

7) Replenish pistol mag loaders with BBs from bag.

Obviously some things take longer than others, and some things may happen in a different order than what I've got here.  In theory, if you have enough time, you can reload your entire complement of magazines.

(http://i44.photobucket.com/albums/f36/castle-bravo/gearandyou/magpuls.jpg)

Dump Pouch -

I consider a dump pouch a necessity. I use mine to stow empty magazines until I can replenish them and replace them into my stockpile of fresh magazines. A dump pouch can also be used as a miscellaneous storage pouch for whatever else you might be required to carry in impromptu conditions.

If I need to reload and its very quick paced, I'll let the magazine hit the ground. I have Magpul Ranger Plates on my mags and I think they provide enough of a cushion against hard surfaces to allow me to let the magazine fall five feet to the ground. If theres some distance between the target and me, theres some cover, and its a bit slower paced, I'll take the extra time to reach around and place my magazine into my dump pouch.

I carry my dump pouch at the seven to eight o'clock position, attached to the rear waist strap of my chest rig. It is out of the way of my other gear, is in a good position to receive magazines from my left hand, and is not obstructed by my hydration carrier. Putting it at the six o'clock position would make it ambidextrous, but the position of my hydration carrier does not allow for this. I haven't found this to be a problem yet.

My preference is the CSM Gear Dump Pouch. Its larger than most, but thats why I like it. It has the capability to cinch down the opening, but I typically run it all the way open. I've not lost a mag, even when its very full and I'm moving around a lot. I've had two other dump pouches - A Tactical Tailor Dump Pouch and a Recce Gear dump pouch, both of which were basically large boxes with openings on the top. They had overlapping areas of elastic to provide a "one way" entrance into the pouch. I think this just made it slower and more difficult to use.

My dump pouch plays a large part in my magazine management strategy that I discussed earlier.

Pistols -

I don't carry a pistol. I used to, but I found that I almost never used it.  I've never experienced an AEG malfunction that wasn't related to the selector being somehow screwed up or the electrical system being messed up. If an AEG has a malfunction that puts it out of the fight, its likely a catastrophic failure that can't be fixed during the game. A pistol would allow you to stay in the fight for a while longer, but you're still going to have to go back to the cars to get a new AEG.

Switching to a pistol is probably faster than reloading a primary magazine for most people, but my experience says that most airsoft exchanges take place at a distance where a pistol would not be accurate enough to kill the enemy with. Cover can usually be found to reload your primary weapon and if you're not surrounded by your friends with long guns to back you up, then you're doing it wrong.

Those reasons are why I don't carry one. I also don't have to carry the extra weight of a pistol and magazines. I also don't have to configure my equipment to carry extra pistol mags.


-----

(http://i44.photobucket.com/albums/f36/castle-bravo/gearandyou/thermobakomega.jpg)

Hydration -

Water is heavy. I'd say my 3 liters of water is over 50% of the weight I carry.

The rule of thumb for water intake during heavy activity is 1 liter per hour. Therefore, 3 liters means 3 hours sustainment, which is about what most airsoft games tend to be, if not a bit shorter. So I think 3 liters of water is perfect for most uses.

Ganef has several great designs that incorporate a hydration system into the rig and have it all one piece. I've gone back and forth between having a separate hydration carrier and an integrated one. Right now, I use a separate Camelbak from my rig. Maybe that will change in the future.


-----

(http://i44.photobucket.com/albums/f36/castle-bravo/gearandyou/commo.jpg)

Communications -

I believe that everyone needs to have a radio. I think that every squad member should be able to tell anyone else exactly whats going on at any given time. Everyone should basically know where everyone is and everyone should never, ever get lost because they were out of contact with their squad.

At Lion Claws 5, being a fireteam leader, I had my radio on the squad channel most of the time. Once or twice, when my squad leader was dead, I had to switch to the platoon channel to talk to the Platoon Leader.  It sucked having to take the radio out of the pouch and divert my attention to it instead of looking around and paying attention to my surroundings like I should have been.  At Lion claws 6, I did have another radio, and it worked great having two separat radios for the squad net and the platoon net.

Having a Push to talk button that is not on the radio itself, I can position a radio somewhere not super easy to access. I have one of mine on the far left of my rig, out of the way. It is low enough that the antenna doesn't poke me in the armpit. It is still in a position where I can adjust the volume if need be, though.  The other radio I carry is directly opposite the first, on my right side.  Neither seem overly intrusive to me.

Communications equipment is a hard thing to peg down. There are so many different options available and so much if it is tied to your own preferences, all I really have to say about it is that you should find what works for you at your price point. After seeing many people purchase inexpensive and sometimes not so inexpensive "low end" headsets, throat mics, and the like, I decided early on that I wasn't going to waste my time and money going through several lesser setups to find what I'd like.  I did some research and purchased a higher end headset.  It was expensive, but the payoff is that it has worked flawlessly across the almost 3 years I've had it now, and I don't suspect it will fail me anytime soon.

-----

At the end of the day, we're all still just playing airball, so I'm not trying to imply or pretend that I'm some high speed guy. One of the kicks I get from airsoft is what I've been talking about here. The guns, the gear, the friends, the environments, and the mechanics of it all make me happy.

All of this didn't happen overnight. I've been playing airsoft for almost 5 1/2 years now, and only recently did I start doing half this stuff I just wrote down. You have to take your own experience into consideration when determining what will work best for you.

I hope this encourages you to consider your setup and make whatever refinements you deem necessary.

And remember, this is A way, not THE way.

-----------
Added 17 Feb 08 -

My "old" gear -

(http://i44.photobucket.com/albums/f36/castle-bravo/gearphotos/toad01.jpg)

Chuckwalla utility pouch, 4x Dual M4 mag pouches, radio pouch, & dump pouch.

I've actually had most of my "new" stuff for almost a year now, but its been quite a while since I took any photos of it.

(http://i44.photobucket.com/albums/f36/castle-bravo/gearphotos/everything.jpg)

The biggest changes I've made is to use open top kydex magazine pouches and two radios.

Although its difficult to see at all, there is a modular chest rig underneath all the pouches.  It is very straightforward.  The body of the rig is mesh for breathability and has no map pockets or anything, because I didn't want any of that.  I like the 2" unpadded seatbelt straps because they are simple and cooperate well with my camelbak sitting over them.

A photo of my old rig that was underneath the pouches in the first picture.  I don't have a photo of the new one,  but this is similar in its simplicity. -

(http://i44.photobucket.com/albums/f36/castle-bravo/gearphotos/toad02.jpg)

Back to the new stuff -

(http://i44.photobucket.com/albums/f36/castle-bravo/gearphotos/dumppouch.jpg)

Detail here of how the dump pouch is secured to the waist strap so that it doesn't shift on the around.  I run my dump pouch on my left side, because I'm right handed, shoot right handed, and drop my mags with my left hand.  Also, because of this, I have the buckle positioned on the right side so that the dump pouch can be as far "forward" as possible.

I have, upon occasion, considered moving my dump pouch to the center of the waist strap to position it so that I could drop magazines into it with my right hand if I was shooting left handed, but as with a lot of things, its kind of robbing Peter to pay Paul - My regular usage of the pouch would suffer just to allow a slight advantage to a situation I'm rarely in. (Reloading with my right hand)  Not to say it doesn't happen, but I can always ditch the mags on the ground.  Not to mention the fact that my Camelbak might stick into it a bit, reducing the size of the mouth of the pouch.

Lately I find myself dropping magazines onto the ground much more often than putting them into my dump pouch, (At least, in the immediate moment) but I still want to have one on me, as I use it for other general utility options.

(http://i44.photobucket.com/albums/f36/castle-bravo/gearphotos/radio.jpg)

Radio pouch.  I use two ICOM F4S radios.  They are positioned on either end of the chest rig.  I don't use the other radio all the time, typically only at large events with multiple radio nets where I need two radios. (depending on my position)  I have some tape around the shock cord to hold the cord over the plug on top of the radio to keep it secure.

As a point of interest, the radio pictured is sitting backwards in the pouch, with the face pointed towards me when I wear it.  This is so that the antenna is inboard and doesn't poke me in the arm pit.  My other radio sits "correctly" in its pouch because the antenna is already inboard.

(http://i44.photobucket.com/albums/f36/castle-bravo/gearphotos/headseth250.jpg)

The radio on my left side is my primary radio and is connected to my LITE II Headset, which is shown here on the right.  This headset is similar to the Bowman PRR headsets and the basis of the Cavalvy Elite I/II headsets.

The item on the left is a H250 handset.  More on that below.

(http://i44.photobucket.com/albums/f36/castle-bravo/gearphotos/u94plug.jpg)

Here you can see my PTT assembly.  There is a disconnect between the PTT and the headset.  I got this setup, because I wanted to be able to change out headsets if I wanted, or attach two radios to one headset. (Something I've since decided against)

The PTT bites pretty hard into whatever you put it onto, so I've had a strip of 1" webbing added to the shoulder strap so that it doesn't tear up the strap underneath.  I'm considering rearranging how I have this setup, as I'm worried that it will interfere with my open top magazine pouches below.  So far, no difficulties, but it seems to me like it might be asking for trouble.

(http://i44.photobucket.com/albums/f36/castle-bravo/gearphotos/h250.jpg)

Another shot of the H250 handset.  You can follow the cord to my 2nd radio on the end of my rig.

At first, I thought the H250 handset was kinda gimmicky, but after using it, a really cool thing happened.  Having an aural and physical separation between the speakers for my radios improves my ability to use them tremendously.  With one radio and speaker being on the left and one being on the right, it is much easier to discern between them and seperate whats going on mentally, even if they're both receiving chatter at the same time.

I wanted to hook two radios to my headset, but now having seen other people with this setup, I don't think I'd like it.  Both radios talking into one ear at the same time seems like a mess to me.

(http://i44.photobucket.com/albums/f36/castle-bravo/gearphotos/singlemag3.jpg)

Open top kydex lined single M4 magazine pouches.  I carry 8 total mags on my rig and 2 reside in these pouches.

Drawing magazines from these pouches, for me, is much faster than drawing a mag from my other pouches.  Ideally, when I reload my weapon, I grab a magazine from one of these pouches and slap it into the gun.  If I've got time, a magazine from one of the other pouches is placed into the open top mag pouch to make it ready again.

These pouches have a kydex liner to make them stiff enough to hold their shape without a magazine in them, as well as provide enough retention to hold the magazine in place under activity.  Some loop velcro inside lets the magazines slide in and out.  The velcro is merely the correct texture to provide friction and a stand off against the kydex - There is not matching velcro on the magazines.  I really like these pouches.  The retention strength is enough to hold the mag in upside down, while running, etc without being so much that it is difficult or slow to extract a mag when you need it.

(http://i44.photobucket.com/albums/f36/castle-bravo/gearphotos/singlemag.jpg)

Here you can see down into one of the pouches with no magazine in it.  You can see the kydex and velcro liner as well.

(http://i44.photobucket.com/albums/f36/castle-bravo/gearphotos/chuckwalla.jpg)

Chuckwalla utility pouch.  On the front wall of it, you can see the six pistol mag loaders.  Each one has an individual slot to go into.  On the back wall, you can see the XL BB loader, multitool, and whistle.  The back wall also has a zippered pouch for stuff I don't want to lose and some grommets for tie downs.

What you can't see (I didn't think to take a photo of the bottom) is the spare radio batteries, GPS batteries, goggle fan batteries, compass, and whatever other stuff I have during a game - like a bag of BBs, granola bars, etc.

(http://i44.photobucket.com/albums/f36/castle-bravo/gearphotos/deathrag.jpg)

Death rag.  Typically I have a square of loop velcro on my headgear and so my death rag stays where I put it.  I also put a lanyard on it so I definately won't lose it.  The death rag is lightweight and folds up nicely so it fits inside the chuckwalla.

(http://i44.photobucket.com/albums/f36/castle-bravo/gearphotos/hydrationcarrier.jpg)

Here you can see my hydration carrier.  It is a Camelbak Thermobak 3 liter.  I run my hydration carrier separate from the rest of my gear.  One of the things I like the best about the Thermobak is that it has a zipper running along the right side.  This zipper allows me to have the drink tube exit the carrier on the bottom, so I can run the drink tube up under my right arm, which is how I prefer it.

The Thermobak is pretty simple and carries only water.  I've contemplated switching to a Camelbak Ambush (or similar) to gain a pouch on the back for additional storage, but typically I don't find myself missing any said storage.

I run my hydration on the right and my commo on the left.  Initially, my rationale was that I didn't want to get my commo items wet, but using nice stuff, it can take it.  So realistically, the reason is more along the lines of the fact that my PTT is more in the way of shouldering my weapon than the drink tube is, so I run the drink tube on the right.

Hope this was informative.

-----------
Added 11 Feb 09 -

I took some photos, so I figured I'd do a small write up -

(http://i44.photobucket.com/albums/f36/castle-bravo/gearphotos/commo04.jpg)

2x ICOM F4S and batteries

The ICOM F4S is a 4 Watt UHF (440-470MHz) radio.  I have 3 batteries for each radio although each battery seems to last all day for the most part.  They are 9.6v 1450mah NiMh batteries.  The battery attaches onto the radio and is about 50% of the total size and about 75% of the total weight.  The batteries come with detachable belt clips, but I don't use them for the most part, as the pouches on my gear a sized for them without clips.

(http://i44.photobucket.com/albums/f36/castle-bravo/gearphotos/commo01.jpg)

TEA LITE II Headset with lower cordset and ICOM F4S Radio

The TEA LITE II Headset is similar to the Bowman PRR headset and the Cavalvy Elite/Elite II.  The base headset is manufactured by Davies and assembled by Television Equipment Associates. (TEA)  The headset downlead ends with a U-93 plug which goes into a lower cordset made up of a U-94 push-to-talk, (PTT) some coiled cabling, and terminates in a standard ICOM plug.  There is a clip on the PTT to attach it to your gear.

One of the reasons that I wanted the LITE II over a comparable TCI offering is the option of having the U-93/U-94 junction inline with the radio.  I wanted to be able to remove the headset and leave the lower cordset "threaded" into my gear.  There is an earpiece cover for loud environments, but I've found it to be almost useless for me.  I have removed the top strap on the headset, as I've found that it does very little in terms of securing it to my head.  This headset gets the most amount of usage by me.

At one point, I wanted to get a lower cordset/PTT that was capable of having input from and output to two separate radios.  The issue with this is that there is only one speaker on only one side of your head with this headset.  This leads me to the next item -

(http://i44.photobucket.com/albums/f36/castle-bravo/gearphotos/commo02.jpg)

H-250 Handset and ICOM F4S Radio

The H-250 is a handset that has a speaker, microphone, and push-to-talk button built into it.  They usually come terminated in a U-229 connector, but this one has a standard ICOM two pin plug.  There is a clip on the back of the handset to attach it to your gear.

I use this handset when I want to use my LITE II headset and two radios.  I usually clip the H-250 to my right shoulder.  This simple aural separation does a wonderful job of letting you keep which radio is receiving straight.  The human brain is very good at distinguishing directional noises, and having a physical separation of radio output to left and right ears allows you to keep track of each.  Its not easy, but it is possible to listen output from both radios at the same time.  This setup has worked very well for me, and while I haven't ever had a dual radio setup outputting into one ear, I've seen others do it with poor results.

(http://i44.photobucket.com/albums/f36/castle-bravo/gearphotos/commo03.jpg)

MSA Ranger MICH Communication Headset with 2x U-94 PTTs terminating in ICOM connectors  and 2x ICOM F4S Radios

The MSA Ranger MICH Communication Headset is built around a Sordin Supreme Pro hearing protection headset.  It has a microphone on a boom to pick up what you're transmitting and 2 cables to plug into whatever PTT that you are using.  In this case, I'm using two MSA manufactured U-94 PTTs with standard ICOM connectors on the other end which plug into the radios.  Each ear cup has two speakers, one lets you hear external noise while suppressing loud noises (such as gunfire, explosions, etc) and the other speaker handles the radio input.  The radio plugged into the right downlead outputs into the right earcup speaker and the left downlead into the left earcup speaker.

I have the gel seal earcups which make a tremendous difference in terms of the comfort of the headset, especially over a long period of time.  

The Ranger MICH Comm headset was something I'd wanted for a long time without any real reason for having one.  I finally picked one up late last year for much less than I thought they'd go for.  Hooray ebay.  Finding the ICOM PTTs was the real trick. :)

(http://i44.photobucket.com/albums/f36/castle-bravo/gearphotos/everything.jpg)

Here is a photo (from a different set) of the chest rig I use and how I'd have the radios, LITE II headset, and H-250 handset setup.  You can see the ICOM radios in their pouches on either end of the rig, and the H-250 going to the right (as worn) radio.  The headset is hooked to the other radio.
Title:
Post by: Raith on July 28, 2006, 07:19:42 PM
Whew.

Comments appreciated.
Title:
Post by: -MAD- SARGE on July 28, 2006, 10:39:20 PM
Ok High speed guy  :lol:

Very good write up!  

I'll put in some of my own personal experiences if you don't mind. Pistol, well I started out with just a pistol, then AEG and then briefly carried both and now I’m just back to my Primary. Irene was the only place I used a pistol and I never fired it once. I did come in handy though as I was loading my mags in an attic and heard a noise, pulling a pistol out instead of loading a mag and repositioning my body to aim my rifle was a much better option. But Like I said, I never fired it, no one came up into the attic and continued to reload...comfortable that my pistol was at my side though.  Other than that, that was the only instance it was drawn. I can carry two more mags instead of the pistol and I value those two primary mags to be worth much more than that of the pistol.  

As for gear not fighting against you, I agree completely.  Though I am very slow at upgrading my gear, I am always trying to find the best way to rig with what I have.  Then when I find that the rig cannot meet my expectations, I am looking for something that will. My problem is experience with all the different kind of rigs out there. Like you said, it takes time and money, which is my hindrance.  And if it works good for me but could be better I will take my time to see what else may work well for me.  

Radio, I have a PTT with a built in volume toggle. This way all I have to do is to place the radio to full volume and then I can regulate the volume at the PTT. Makes it very easy.

Mags, I started out with 4 total for LC  3.  At that event it was all I needed, but as engagements become more and more fierce, I now carry 8 mags total.  7 in the rig with a mag reloader...or what used to be a reloader....melted. Plus I keep one in the gun. I loved that mag loader for LC5, ah it worked so well, easy to load and to reload.  Never needed my pistol loaders. Emergency Reloads, I do them all the time. If I’m in a crunch, I will drop a mag with no hesitation. I found that in the field, the ground is soft enough to take the impact of the mag. That and the mag isn’t too heavy either. I will even leave the mag/mags on the ground until I have cleared the enemy sufficiently to allow me to gather my mags.  I have never had a problem with any of my mags getting damaged and I only have 550 cord, no ranger plates.  I too will also reload if I know I do not have a fresh mag, especially when I know that I am going to engage multiple contacts.  Never really want to reload when you had someone dead to rights.

Right now I have my own gear issues. Can only carry my radio in the front, thus the wires for the mic can become entangled in my gun when I switch shoulders when aiming. Hydration carrier has limited storage capacity cannot carry a lunch or snacks, only ammo.  I don’t have a place to put a dump pouch and I need one. Currently I am using my canteen pouch as a dump pouch but it can only hold 3 mags before it starts getting cumbersome and 4 is its limit. Then it is to my cargo pants and I don’t need to say why I don’t like that.  

Pros for my set up are I carry 3 liters of water.  Easy access to my extra ammo bags in my hydration rear pocket. Nothing is placed in the chest area as my gun is always almost positioned near there. Rig is light, stays in place and by having the hydration and rig separate, it keeps them well balanced. I have had the two integrated before and the hydration system would pull on the rig causing the front to ride up high on my chest and that was a no go.  On thing I like and is only due to the shortness of the airsoft mag is that the flap for the mag pouch comes down well past where it velcros. So I have no need for a pull-tab, the whole front flap is a pull-tab and is very easy to manipulate. If the mags were real mags, I could not do this with my current rig and it would just suck trying to pull two seamless Velcro parts apart.
Title:
Post by: Raith on July 29, 2006, 12:51:30 AM
Quote from: "-MAD- SARGE"
Currently I am using my canteen pouch as a dump pouch but it can only hold 3 mags before it starts getting cumbersome and 4 is its limit. Then it is to my cargo pants and I don’t need to say why I don’t like that.  

It sounds like what you should maybe do is commission Ganef to make a dump pouch for you and use the canteen pouch as a utility pouch to hold ammo/food/etc.

Quote
I have had the two integrated before and the hydration system would pull on the rig causing the front to ride up high on my chest and that was a no go.


Yeah, I've run across this before too.  I remember that 12 magazines in the front didn't even balance out 3 liters of water.  Water is too heavy.
Title:
Post by: Kurn on July 29, 2006, 01:52:36 AM
Quote from: "Raith"
Quote from: "-MAD- SARGE"
I have had the two integrated before and the hydration system would pull on the rig causing the front to ride up high on my chest and that was a no go.

Yeah, I've run across this before too.  I remember that 12 magazines in the front didn't even balance out 3 liters of water.  Water is too heavy.


I too have had that problem.  The trick is to use carbonated water, so that the bubbles help take some of the weight off of the back  :D

Seriously though, I think having your camelback integrated onto your rig, or having it be a separate piece of gear largely depends on personal preference.  I’ll tried both ways, and have found that I much prefer to have as many things integrated into my rig as possible.  I have noticed that having a sling that is directly attached to my vest helps to balance it out.

Excellent post Raith, there's a lot of good information there.
Title:
Post by: Ganef on July 29, 2006, 03:26:55 PM
Great post and nice to see that CT is setting folks up right and living up to the slogan "legit kit, no shit"

Ryan, I have thought about that exact problem and the solution I came up with is making the attached hydration wear like its own backpack and having the rig attach to it, so that the weight is distributed like you normally wear a backpack and not a uneven see-saw. I have something in mind for you CT is gonna hook you up nicely.

Matt brings up a bunch of realy good points that we all can use to rethink our kit and streamline it up a bit.
Title:
Post by: -MAD- SARGE on July 29, 2006, 06:20:44 PM
Quote from: "Ganef"
I have something in mind for you CT is gonna hook you up nicely.

WOOT!  If you need to meet me sometime to go over things let me know. I can aslo bring my current set up so we can see what works/doesn't for me and what I can and can not get to currently (reaching capabilities).
Title:
Post by: Airsofter1 on August 02, 2006, 01:34:05 AM
At LC 5 I wanted to go with something lighter than what I have been carrying  around recently with my fake CIRAS set-up.  So I went with my SOTech Hellcat figuring I would haul a lighter load around the hills of Ledesma Valley and be able to take the fight farther with less fatigue.  I ended up carrying almost the usual amount of gear I have been carrying with my CIRAS set-up minus a few items.  Looking back I think I would have preferred to run the CIRAS platform.

The Camelback Thermoback I bought specifically to use in the event ended up being a small problem for me.  I wanted a different hydration system than a docked setup in the back of the CIRAS; I wanted to be able to easily take off the Camelback to fill up between missions.  While it was certainly easier to re-fill, it was a bit more of strain on my narrow shoulders.  I kept having to adjust the shoulder straps around because of the way it laid over my Hellcat straps.  It was something I purchased a week before the event without using one prior.

I always try to format my load-out similar to what I will be using at the big games.  In the last year or so I have been in a command role so that has shaped my load-out some what.  My role as a game host also plays into this as well.  In my airsoft world, the two gear requirements are similar.
This is the typical amount of crap I would like to carry on my body:
(http://img70.imageshack.us/img70/4199/dsc02720wr3.jpg)

My weapon:  I am a big fan of the ready mag system.  Mag changes under stress are much faster and safer.  To me and my 21 inch guns the extra weight is negligible and the benefit far outweighs the cons.

Ammunition:  There was once a time were I actually carried 25 mags in to battle.  One in the weapon and 24 on my body.  Now I typically try to carry 8-10 on my body, with two mags in the weapon.  For our usual weekend games I rarely go through half that.  At the big games it varies quite a bit - I emptied every mag (18 total) at LC 3 during the last mission, but at LC 4 I didnt fire a single shot on Saturday.  With the invention of the pistol mag loaders, and now the larger M4 mag shaped loaders, the need for one person to carry 50 mags into battle is largely diminished.

Water: I used to just carry 2 liters in to battle, but have since graduated to 3 liters because it sucks running out of water 2/3 the way into a fight.

Communications:  From almost the beginning I have carried two radios.  In almost every instances I am listening to both of them at the same time.  In my position as a game organizer this is so I can help manage the fighting between both sides of the game to keep things flowing and fun for all.  In the command role at big games I find it crucial to have as much information coming in as possible to make the important decisions that could lead men to victory or a red rag sea of death.  Being able to monitor two channels with the option of easily switching to other channels is important in any big game command role, from squad leader to task force commander.

The misc. stuff:  All the rest of the stuff I carry because either I have needed them at least twice in the field at a big game.  The exception is the flashlight.  That is one of those items that fills an empty space in my load-out that does not hinder my ability to wage make believe war.  I only carry two pistol mag shaped loaders.  I usually load mags off of one and re-fill it as I go.  I keep the second one as a back-up should the first one break or a loaner be needed.

I don't always carry a pistol, and and when I do (like most of us) it rarely gets used.  But I still like to carry one when I can, because you never know.  I may need it, or someone else may need it to cover me while I fix their AEG in the field with my multi-tool.

Recently I have been keeping a small first-aid kit with me out on the field:
(http://img70.imageshack.us/img70/3451/dsc02716lu6.jpg)
Band-aids and Advil mostly, like Matt.  A few other small items that I feel may be helpful for quick remedies out in the field.  Blistex for chapped lips, burn cream for sun burned ear tips, hydrocortisone for those chaffed legs, and the little splinter out tool for removing those painfully debilitating splinters and cactus needles.  It all fits inside that little water-proof cigarette case.  I need to paint that someday.

My many discussions with Matt over the years has helped form what type of gear and equipment I carry.  It is a ever evolving thing for me, one journey that I will always be on the path of....
Title:
Post by: Raith on August 02, 2006, 01:35:00 PM
That is a cool little case, Mikey.  I put my mini-med kit in a baseball card protector.
Title:
Post by: Fish on August 02, 2006, 01:52:41 PM
Hey great info guys, I was deciding what to actually bring to games and stuff and this is alot of help. I also don't carry my sidearm anymore because I don't use it and it just slows me down. Thanks!
Title:
Post by: Farslayer on August 02, 2006, 03:25:05 PM
Thank you Gentlemen for your invaluable input.  I actually have asked Hawk to roughly base the rig he is making for me off of your's Matt.  I do believe that you can have a functional, lighter rig....and still look cool.  I do need a dump pouch...but maybe I can use my BH extra large fanny for that.  We'll see.

I'd love another headset like the one Matt has (again), but I don't think I can afford it.  I am using one with an accoustic plastic tube, it works great.

The new guys should read this thread.  It would help.
Title:
Post by: Ghostsequel on August 02, 2006, 05:50:33 PM
My humble addition to this thread:

Like a lot of you, I like to carry a light kit that allows me to move pretty much unhindered.

My rig is a copy of a RACK (made by CT- and it kicks ass).  I've got 3 double M4 mag pouches (6 mags on the vest, 1 in the gun).  I've got a GP pouch on one side, where I carry an extra battery, swiss army knife, and soon a med kit.  Probably soon add a small radio pouch and a pistol holster (or single M4 pouch to fill the role).  For a dump pouch, I've been using the cargo pockets on my BDUs(ghetto, I know), and just putting them back into the rig during down time.  Just picked up an IT dump pouch, going to try it out and see how it works for me.

As for sidearms, I understand many of you guys don't use them, but I've been to enough games where my hexed M4 dies on me and I've been extremely glad I decided to pack my pistol, too.  One thing I would definately stay away from, however, is a drop leg holster.  I used to run with one and an extra pistol mag on my leg, and the damned thing would be flopping and rolling around.  To hell with that.

Hydration.  Camelbacks are the coolest damn things in the world.  Picked up a 3L, and it's probably the most valuable $ I've spent in this whole thing.  It fits well, stays out of my way, and carries enough to keep me going.
Title:
Post by: seanm028 on August 02, 2006, 06:24:24 PM
Personally, I've always favored the medic role, even when I wasn't airsofting.  I have looked at medical field kits, but they were too big or bulky to carry.

Instead, I have some basic supplies (electrolytes, large bandaid, compression bandages, alcohol swabs) that I carry in my vest.  Then, in a refurbished ammunition box in my car or at the loadout zone, I have a complete medical kit with much more supplies.

I've used experience from the field as well as knowledge gained from the several members of my family who practice medicine to custom build my first aid kit, rather than buy a pre-packaged kit with stuff it says you need.

The only thing I still think I should get and have at least in my kit, if not in my vest, is one of those suction devices for snake bites.
Title:
Post by: Vince on August 02, 2006, 06:32:00 PM
A note re medical kits :

We don't have anyone qualified to render medical aid who plays with any regularity, so, anything over bandaids, rubbing alcohol, electrolytes, and gauze is unnecessary and maybe dangerous. Snakebite kits have largely fallen out of vogue because if used incorrectly could probably dick up the person trying to use it and to boot, not have a beneficial effect on the afflicted person.
Title:
Post by: seanm028 on August 02, 2006, 06:46:32 PM
Quote from: "Vince"
A note re medical kits :

We don't have anyone qualified to render medical aid who plays with any regularity, so, anything over bandaids, rubbing alcohol, electrolytes, and gauze is unnecessary and maybe dangerous. Snakebite kits have largely fallen out of vogue because if used incorrectly could probably dick up the person trying to use it and to boot, not have a beneficial effect on the afflicted person.


I understand that and in that case, probably won't get a snakebite thing.

I have however been through basic first aid training as well as more specific stuff for the various items I carry in my kit.

For example, I have not been trained to use tourniquets and, even though they could save a life, they could also be used improperly and kill someone.  Therefore, I don't carry any.

I have been trained to use compression bandages and how to properly dress/irrigate wounds, as well as use QuikClot (even though I don't carry any, I think it's pretty pointless as long as there's not real bullets flying around) and so I carry everything to do that.

There's also a bunch of other random things I've been taught beyond dressing wounds because I'm sure many of you would argue that anyone can do that.

I think it's simply an issue of how much experience you have.  It certainly helps having a dad who used to be a clinical educator at the hospital.  :lol:
Title:
Post by: HavHav on August 02, 2006, 07:07:57 PM
If you guys feel like being liable for any medical treatment you give, go ahead. But my personal deal is only do what you are QUALIFIED to. I carry band-aids, advil, tylenol, electrolites, some neosporin, and a few bandages. Sure I 'know' how to shove a tube down someones throat, but does that make me qualified?

Not to stray too far off topic, but you guys have put a great deal of time into these posts, and they are some excellent reading material.
Title:
Post by: KOBO on August 03, 2006, 12:02:51 PM
As far as first aid kits go it is good to have the stuff for the lighter cuts and so on. I would add to carry some wraps, if you have spare room to house it. Hopefully we never need anything to do open surgery on the field, but what I see has good potential other then getting scratched up by the brush is rolling your ankle or sprains. With the terain and fast pace action it is easy to loose your footing or trip and fall. Wraps can imobilize your ankle or what not for us to get anyone back to the cars. And in severe case where something may be broken a wrap can be used to tie of splints. Another good tool is the comb! I am sure alot of you have seen the comb I keep on my rig to keep my goatee clean, but it is great for pulling cacti out of your legs.

Great write up on the gear for the field, unfortanatly I am one who carries way to much.
Title:
Post by: Ghostsequel on August 03, 2006, 12:26:35 PM
Quote from: "Vince"
A note re medical kits :

We don't have anyone qualified to render medical aid who plays with any regularity, so, anything over bandaids, rubbing alcohol, electrolytes, and gauze is unnecessary and maybe dangerous. Snakebite kits have largely fallen out of vogue because if used incorrectly could probably dick up the person trying to use it and to boot, not have a beneficial effect on the afflicted person.


I'm a registered EMT-B, and am qualified to do all kinds of things like setting up IVs (though not administering them), C-Spine precautions, administering activated charcoal, treating gunshot wounds, inserting OPAs and NPAs, working AEDs, etc.  The thing is that for airsoft med kits, I don't need anything other than basic first aid stuff.  Gauze, rubbing alcohol, maybe some charcoal in case anyone swallows something really harmful (poisonous plants, for example), etc.  A protective barrier for CPR (though I doubt it'd ever be used, it takes up extremely little space).  And a few pairs of exam gloves for BSI reasons.

HavHav, you have a good point about liability; only do what you're qualified for.  I could probably intubate a person if I need to, insert an IV, all that good stuff, but I'm not qualified.  Unless it's a life or death thing, I'm not doing it.  The nice thing is the Good Samaritan laws protect those who render medical treatment and are not doing so in the course of their job.  Not that I'd want to rely on that, given the way our sue-happy legal system runs, but at least it's there.
Title:
Post by: Vince on August 03, 2006, 12:30:42 PM
You quoted me, so, I know you read my post -- I said with regularity..I haven't seen you at many games. I believe Benn Psalms also carries a certification or two, but he's in the same boat with you.
Title:
Post by: Ghostsequel on August 03, 2006, 12:49:49 PM
Quote from: "Vince"
You quoted me, so, I know you read my post -- I said with regularity..I haven't seen you at many games. I believe Benn Psalms also carries a certification or two, but he's in the same boat with you.


No, I know what you mean, man.  And no, I don't play AA games regularly, though I would friggin love to and have a blast when I get to them  8) .  My purpose in quoting you was more to talk about the necessity and use of items in a med kit, not how often I play.  Regardless of what medical stuff I'm qualified to do, I only really need basic first aid stuff.  Hell, I could deliver a baby, but I'm damn sure not going to carry the necessary equipment with me to airsoft.

Also just pointing out some other great and simple things to have in a kit, like the CPR barrier and gloves.
Title:
Post by: TimW on August 03, 2006, 11:19:00 PM
Unfortunately, I haven't (and therefore, don't) play airsoft. So all my stuff deals with real guns and real bullets.

In my line of work, I have the distinct advantage of being able to try a LOT of stuff.  There are quite a few righs out there I like, some I don't dislike and others I hate.

IMO, it comes down to WHY you're using it.

For example, I have run a couple of shootnig matches.  There, I use the PHUTV from Eagle...a nice small chest rig that carries more than enough mags and some pistol mags, too.  A dump pouch on my belt and I am set.

If I am out doing search and rescue, I'll use my Warlord with my Glock secured inside it, out of the way and unobtrusive.  With a big enough pack, I might end up carrying an SBR since some of the stuff is down in the brush, near the border.

If camping/hiking/putzing around, I might use my MESA vest. On it I will be attaching 2 cool 4-mag shingles Ganef made up for me. So I"ll have 8 mags + one in the gun.  More than I can imagine needing.  Plus it hold a hydration pack and I can wear a backpack over it.

If I think I am going to be someplace that might actually turn into a two-way range, I'll wear something like the Eagle LEO armor carrier or a CIRAS (since I now carry the kevlar panels for them...).  This go-to-war rig would be the last thing I'd want to wear, since with armor and plates it weighs 23 pounds before I attach anything else. Ugh.
Title:
Post by: Farslayer on August 03, 2006, 11:26:38 PM
Tim,
You should post pictures of this stuff.
Title:
Post by: Wicked-Mpact on August 04, 2006, 12:30:49 AM
As far as medical kits goes, I pretty much have the same mentioned above. Been to lots of games and OPs and this is what was actually used.

Cleaning Pads/Band-Aids
- Used a few times but recently when a player was injured but bleeding a lot from a minor laceration, questionable environment was cause for immediate attention.
Gauze/wrap
- Operation Restore order, teammate was patched up (not by me) from a bad cut on his hand from broken glass in a window.
Bee Sting Ointment
- OP Serpent Hammer our squad was attacked by dozens of bees/hornets
Advil/ ibuprofen
- Very Important!
Tweezers
- Splinters are common
Chapstick
- Didn't have it at the time but it seriously affected a team member’s ability, rendering pretty much in-operable :D

For the most part when dealing with my own blood a CLEAN death rag comes in handy this is why I wash mines now
Title:
Post by: Kurn on August 04, 2006, 01:37:09 AM
I'll post my load out tomorrow, but for now I wanted to post my thoughts on the medical kit subject.

I have no medical knowledge what so ever, so I carry a very small first aid kit on me (band-aids, allergy pills).  I keep a few more things in my car, but I figure if I or someone else gets seriously hurt the best thing to do would be to get them to the closest hospital as soon as possible.

Oddly enough, I have hurt myself more in the staging area, or on the way there, then I have during an actual game.
Title:
Post by: Firehead on August 04, 2006, 04:21:15 AM
I am CLS certified, Vince, and I'd consider myself a regular(except for lately). I carry Epipen, along with IV fluid, and a few other drugs in my CLS bag.
Title:
Post by: Bullseye on August 04, 2006, 08:05:45 AM
Basically the rules are (or should be):
1) Take nothing you aren't trained to do (I'm an ex-EMT/A with over 2 years exp working for an Ambulance service, plus formerly certified as an ARC Adv. First Aid Instructor, BTW FWIW). Band-Aids, tweezers, analgesics, etc are all fine.

2) As long as you act within your level of training, the states Good Samaritan Act covers you legally from lawsuit. So far, no one has been sucessfully sued if they stayed within their training limits....

3) Unless you contract and PAY someone to provide Emergency Care at an event, expect NO assistance except for Buddy- or Self- care but be thankful for what you get  ;)

A Tip: Carry Pepcid. One, it can cut the upper GI distress if you take Ibuprofen in quantity. Two A single Pepcid, followed by two Benedryl works wonders for severe allergic reactions. Pepcid amplifies the effect of Benedryl by up to FOUR TIMES. I had a severe case of hives a couple years ago when my stepfather-in-law died suddenly - this is what ER's do (except in IV format). Not quite as fast as an EpiPen, but....
Title:
Post by: Raith on March 06, 2007, 08:27:34 PM
I've made this a sticky.  I think theres a lot of people who didn't catch this the first time around.
Title:
Post by: Raith on June 22, 2007, 12:52:47 PM
I've updated my original post to include some more recent examples as well as make some things more easily read.  (The gist is the same)

Additional things that do not fit into the original article -

Boots
Gloves
Kneepads

Boots should be pretty obvious.  Most good ones are made out of leather and cordura or the like and they're thick enough to shrug off most thorns and other pokies you'll find.

Gloves and kneepads are something that I've always worn when playing airsoft and I can't see myself doing so without them.

I have what I think are the nicest gloves out there.  They're expensive for gloves, but they work great for me.  I haven't had any kind of problems with them since I've had them and though I'm a bit less dexterous than I would be without them, I feel that the trade off is quite worth it.  If your gloves get torn up, at least its them rather than your hands.  The ability to touch/interact with pokey, hot, dirty, or stuff that would otherwise hurt your hands is invaluable.  Crossing a fence, getting in a vehicle, etc. make it worth having nice gloves, I think.

I consider kneepads to be essential as well.  The one or two times I've not worn them, I've regretted it, even in a short game.  Aside from the usual cactus/pokey protection, they allow you to somewhat comfortably take a knee or monica position for an extended period of time.

I'm not too keen on elbow pads.  I'm sure they have place, and getting your elbows messed up does suck, but for me, they've only really been in the way.

----

Also, here is a list of specifically what I use now and some comments on them -

Eyewear -
Oakley SI M Frame 2.0
Bolle T-800 Goggles

While I don't wish to discuss sealed vs non sealed eyewear here, I will talk about glasses.  I feel that the Oakley M Frame and M Frame 2.0s that I wear now provide an adequate degree of protection for me.  When you get down to it, everything is a compromise and everything in what we do is a calculated risk.  This is no different.  I've had fogging problems before and one of my solutions to that has been the Oakley M Frame.  I take the responsibility of knowing that I have the perhaps slightly reduced protection of glasses to have the greater visibility that they afford me.  End of story on that one.

The Bolle T-800s are my current favorite goggle.  I've had none of the same fogging issues that I've had with other goggles, including the ESS Turbofans.  Not really too much else to be said about them.

Undershirt -
PolarMAX All Year Undergear T-Shirt

I've had these for a couple of years now and they're starting to pill and I think their wicking effectiveness has been reduced.  I plan to replace them with some 5.11 or Zensah undershirts.

Load Carriage -

Coyote Tactical Mesh Chest Rig
Coyote Tactical Kydex Single M4 Magazine Pouch (x2)
Coyote Tactical Dual M4 Magazine Pouch (x3)
Coyote Tactical Mockingbird ICOM F4S Radio Pouch (x2)
Coyote Tactical Chuckwalla Utility Pouch

Most of the commentary I have on these items can be found in the initial post in this thread.

Hydration -
Camelbak 3L Thermobak Omega

Its simple, compact and does the job I want it to.  An added bonus is that because of how the zipper is, I can route the drink tube under my arm, rather than over my shoulder.  I prefer this way, as it ends with the drink tube pointing up at your head, rather than down at your feet.

Gloves -
Southwest Motorsports Digital Friction Fighter NT Gloves

The gloves I mention above are these.  They're definately some of the more expensive gloves out there, but I feel they are the best for me.  Before these, I used Hatch Operator gloves.  I really like the Hatch Operators, but the SWMS Friction Fighters blow them out of the water.  They are less dexterous, but far, far more stout.  With Southwest Motorsports' absorption into Camelbak, I think the availability of these has been reduced and the cost has likely increased, but I'm not sure.

Kneepads -
Alta Industries Superflex Knee Pads w/Altalok Buckle

The final word in kneepads.  They look the same as the Hatch, Blackhawk, etc ones, but they are much, much nicer.  Unlike some of the others, they stay where you put them and don't bite into your legs.  $5-10 more than other brands, but in my opinion definately worth it.

Socks -
Thorlo Combat Boot Sock

These socks are the best I've found, though I've not looked very hard for socks. :P  Nice and thick where it seems to matter, they've not given me a problem.  They're expensive for socks, but I've had the same ones for a long time now.

Boots -
Wellco Value Cool Lite Infantry Combat Boots (VCL ICB)

I've not had any problems with these boots in the nearly 5 years I've used them.  Since I really only use them for airsoft and the occasional hike, they've held up just fine.  I think that the quality of Wellco materials and workmanship has declined since I purchased these, so I don't think I'd buy the same thing again when I finally do need new boots.

----

I hope to continue to expand this thread with pertinent information.
Title:
Post by: djmtott on June 22, 2007, 01:52:20 PM
Good stuff, and I agree 100% about the kneepads. I bought mine before my first game, and I'll never go without them.
Title:
Post by: TimW on June 22, 2007, 02:14:31 PM
Quote from: "Raith"
Socks -
Thorlo Combat Boot Sock

These socks are the best I've found, though I've not looked very hard for socks. :P  Nice and thick where it seems to matter, they've not given me a problem.  They're expensive for socks, but I've had the same ones for a long time now.


That's what that smell is.  Perhaps we can take up a collection so you can get a second pair of socks. :D

As for the SWMS gloves, I am a camelbak dealer.  If anyone is SERIOUS about wanting some, I will gladly make inquiry into pricing and availability.  You won't pay retail, but I can't guarantee you a price at this juncture.

Finally, nice list and comments...where did you purchase the socks?
Title:
Post by: Raith on June 22, 2007, 03:01:33 PM
Quote from: "TimW"
That's what that smell is.  Perhaps we can take up a collection so you can get a second pair of socks. :D

I have four pairs of them. :P

Quote
Finally, nice list and comments...where did you purchase the socks?


Thanks, Arizona Tactical.  $12 or so, I think.
Title:
Post by: PHX COBRA on June 22, 2007, 03:37:25 PM
I've taken a liking to the Thorlo Light hikers, they breath real well, but are thicker overall and fit my feet in most shoes very well.  I have 11 pairs of them and a few for over 2yrs and they are still like new shape.  Wear them as everyday socks.
I also got a pack of the Costco light hiking socks and they are surprisingly comfortable as well, almost as good as the Thorlos.
Title:
Post by: devildog16 on December 13, 2007, 10:28:04 PM
Hey right now I have an el cheapo Cross Draw vest and a camelback tucked inside.  I know modular would be better.   I've checked at Laradas but either i wasnt looking in the right place or they didnt have them.   Where is a good place to find the vest and pouches/attachments? I'm primarily looking for surplus stores around the valley but is there any other place you would recomend?
Title:
Post by: AddoAduro on December 14, 2007, 11:37:41 PM
I don't think this is really the right place for this, but I'd recommend the following (It's what I use, and I love it. Also where I bought it from, they rock too. ;) )

Camelbak Delta 5 (http://www.practicaltactical.net/prostores/servlet/-strse-249/Camelbak-Delta-5-Tactical/Detail)

HSGI  Universal Double Modular Pouch (http://www.practicaltactical.net/prostores/servlet/-strse-88/HSG-Universal-Modular-Mag/Detail)

I grabbed a couple other things too, but those are the important ones. ;)
Title:
Post by: devildog16 on December 15, 2007, 05:35:06 PM
ok thanks Addo I'll check em out.
Title:
Post by: TimW on December 15, 2007, 06:06:47 PM
I have the Delta vest in Black and Foliage green in stock,  and the UMMP double in Khaki, MultiCam and OD.  I also carry Tactical Tailor gear now, too.

Tim
Title:
Post by: Ares on March 09, 2008, 12:53:04 PM
Dead thread? I think not.

My rig.
(http://i89.photobucket.com/albums/k236/juturna485/DSC_0084.jpg)

This is how I have it assembled for a sort of, middle-weight, mobile style. I can attach more magazines and some different pouches if I think I'll need it all. I have all the mags from right to left as opposed to just one side. Any additional ammo would go on the left hand side, which would make ammo draw much easier.

(http://i89.photobucket.com/albums/k236/juturna485/DSC_0082.jpg)

I chose panels instead of pouches because I find them to be easier to use.    There are no flaps to fondle with when its time to reload, and they're more versatile because of the webbing, the user can add whatever they need.

The "Gadget" pouch on the right holds my tool kit and allen wrenches. I keep these on my rig for all the obvious reasons, being able to fix whatever, where I need to.

In the full shot up top, you can see the water hose going along the shoulder pad. I used a couple of grimloc's to route the hose upward, so I don't have to play search and grab if I can't see it. As below.

(http://i89.photobucket.com/albums/k236/juturna485/DSC_0083.jpg)

The admin carries all the usual, radio code cheat sheets, maps... sometimes my keys... whatever. The two small pouches on the right carry  a Surefire and a Leatherman, and for a sling I have some paracord and a carabiner. Quick and dirty sling, but its effective.

The rig closes in the front, by the two velcro panels in picture 2 overlapping under another flap of velcro under the mags in the center (pic 3), so all 6 mags are in a straight line.

For reloading, I no longer use an XL loader, but rather several small loaders (as per Raith, thank you sir!) They'll go in a mini chuck just the same, except I'll have pouches inside the chuck for the tools and allens, which would replace the gadget pouch all together. The normal pistol style loaders are better for me because I use GP mags. This lets me raload with one loader for each refreshed magazine, no counting or ending up with 3 full mags and one half full.

Any questions?
Title:
Post by: F0rgiven on April 08, 2008, 06:58:58 PM
how much did that entire rig run you?  Looks perfect.
Title: Re: Gear & YOU: Working Towards A Better Future (TM)
Post by: Raith on June 29, 2008, 11:42:18 AM
BTT - I've recently suggested a few people read this - Hopefully this will spur them on.
Title: Re: Gear & YOU: Working Towards A Better Future (TM)
Post by: Seedy on July 30, 2008, 08:54:28 AM
I have a few questions-

I've been looking at two Eagle Industries plate carriers.

One with a Cummerbund ($200)-

(http://www.eagleindustries.com/images/P/344_Large.jpg)

and one without ($150)-

(http://www.eagleindustries.com/images/P/341_Large.jpg)


I'm having a hard time deciding which one to get and was wondering if the guys who own carriers like these could speak up.
you can actually remove the cummerbund on the one that comes with one incase I don't like it. the extra space on the cummerbund for pouches and stuff looks nice but it will be tricky arranging them on the seams where the cummerbund opens up. doesn't look like I could save money by getting the combined double and triple mag pouches.. I'd have to go with 6 to 8 single stand alone mags (expensive). the cummerbund also looks like it might be kind of hot and heavy for wearing in the heat.
then again I would not want to kick myself for getting the carrier that does not come with one because I don't want to find out down the road that I've run out of space on my vest to put pouches.
so which kind of carriers you guys like, ones with or without cummerbunds?
thanks
Title: Re: Gear & YOU: Working Towards A Better Future (TM)
Post by: Ganef on July 30, 2008, 09:46:17 AM
Plate carriers have more nylon restricting airflow and are just going to be hotter than chest rigs with less area.

Part of what raith was getting at with this thread is to take a serious look at what you need on the field and build your kit around that. Don't buy some vest with every pouch imaginable and then fill every slot.

I rethink my kit for every major event. For instance I in the previous years have used a fully integrated kit meaning that my hydration, ammo and everything was on one platform. This last game I tried out having my hydration on a separate system. I slimmed down my mag count to 6, I carried 8 pistol speedloaders to offset the lack of immediate mags, I had a radio, bag of bbs, red rag, camera, gps and camelbak, that was it. And this was no simple field op either, this was a hard core mout environment. I did not feel like I was missing anything, and all my gear performed perfectly.

Lay out your loadout and think about how to consolidate it into the simplest kit.
Title: Re: Gear & YOU: Working Towards A Better Future (TM)
Post by: Raith on July 30, 2008, 10:07:35 AM
I think the answer to this question lies in what you plan on carrying.  Mags, Radio, Water, reloading capability, etc.

The Plate Carrier with no cummerbund is 12 PALS columns across, which is not a whole lot of real estate, but you can certainly get by with it if you're not carrying a whole lot.  Remember that your radio and hydration can go on the back.

If you do get one - http://www.practicaltactical.net/prosto ... ith/Detail (http://www.practicaltactical.net/prostores/servlet/-strse-219/Eagle-Plate-Carrier-with/Detail)
Title: Re: Gear & YOU: Working Towards A Better Future (TM)
Post by: Seedy on July 30, 2008, 10:19:29 AM
Quote from: "Ganef"
Plate carriers have more nylon restricting airflow and are just going to be hotter than chest rigs with less area.

Part of what raith was getting at with this thread is to take a serious look at what you need on the field and build your kit around that. Don't buy some vest with every pouch imaginable and then fill every slot.

I rethink my kit for every major event. For instance I in the previous years have used a fully integrated kit meaning that my hydration, ammo and everything was on one platform. This last game I tried out having my hydration on a separate system. I slimmed down my mag count to 6, I carried 8 pistol speedloaders to offset the lack of immediate mags, I had a radio, bag of bbs, red rag, camera, gps and camelbak, that was it. And this was no simple field op either, this was a hard core mout environment. I did not feel like I was missing anything, and all my gear performed perfectly.

Lay out your loadout and think about how to consolidate it into the simplest kit.

yes last weekend was badass indeed  :)
I don't intend on filling up my whole carrier with pouches, I'll just have on me what I need.
I've had chest rigs in the past, I use a SPEARS rig right now, but want to switch over to a modern plate carrier because I like the "look".
once I get my carrier all I'll have on it is four double M4 mag pouches, a large medical pouch just to keep crap in like BB's and what-not, an admin pouch with velcro on the front to stick name tape on and keeps maps inside, a hydration carrier on the back and a radio pouch on top of that. that should be about it unless I find the need for anything else.
Title: Re: Gear & YOU: Working Towards A Better Future (TM)
Post by: Seedy on July 30, 2008, 10:23:46 AM
Quote from: "Raith"
I think the answer to this question lies in what you plan on carrying.  Mags, Radio, Water, reloading capability, etc.

The Plate Carrier with no cummerbund is 12 PALS columns across, which is not a whole lot of real estate, but you can certainly get by with it if you're not carrying a whole lot.  Remember that your radio and hydration can go on the back.

If you do get one - http://www.practicaltactical.net/prosto ... ith/Detail (http://www.practicaltactical.net/prostores/servlet/-strse-219/Eagle-Plate-Carrier-with/Detail)

the plain carrier without the cummerbund would probably work if I just wanted the four M4 double mag pouches across the front but I also like having a "stash bag" like an medical pouch and there would be no place to put that without the extra real estate the cummerbund offers on the sides.
I'm going to get the one that you linked to.
better to have the cummerbund and be able to remove it then get the one without it and not have one at all.
thanks for all your help.
Title: Re: Gear & YOU: Working Towards A Better Future (TM)
Post by: DMAN007 on August 07, 2008, 08:07:25 PM
This is a great post, it helps out a lot since I've recently been looking for a good gear setup and this gave me several ideas, thanks again
Title: Re: Gear & YOU: Working Towards A Better Future (TM)
Post by: Raith on August 07, 2008, 08:57:35 PM
Quote from: "DMAN007"
This is a great post, it helps out a lot since I've recently been looking for a good gear setup and this gave me several ideas, thanks again

No problem, thats why I wrote it.  Glad to help out and inspire.
Title: Re: Gear & YOU: Working Towards A Better Future (TM)
Post by: DMAN007 on August 08, 2008, 04:37:02 PM
I have a non related question for Raith, How do you get the pictures of the guns on your signature??? I"ve been wondering this for a while.
Title: Re: Gear & YOU: Working Towards A Better Future (TM)
Post by: thatoneguy92088 on August 08, 2008, 06:34:47 PM
http://www1.ocn.ne.jp/~avro504/gunicon.html (http://www1.ocn.ne.jp/~avro504/gunicon.html)

or to customize it

http://dragonflyteam.free.fr/pimpmyairsoft/# (http://dragonflyteam.free.fr/pimpmyairsoft/#)
Title: Re: Gear & YOU: Working Towards A Better Future (TM)
Post by: Bully Dog Airsoft on February 08, 2009, 07:58:02 PM
I have a question, where did you get your radio set?  Also the url below is a great product to cary in your guy's med kits, I always keep a few packets of it in mine. It really works great, even helps with the pain and itching of cat claw!

http://www.biolife.com/images/Pkg_urgentQR_app.jpg
Title: Re: Gear & YOU: Working Towards A Better Future (TM)
Post by: Raith on February 08, 2009, 11:01:16 PM
Quote from: "Bully Dog Airsoft"
I have a question, where did you get your radio set?  Also the url below is a great product to cary in your guy's med kits, I always keep a few packets of it in mine. It really works great, even helps with the pain and itching of cat claw!

http://www.biolife.com/images/Pkg_urgentQR_app.jpg

If you're talking about the radios - ebay.

If you're talking about the headset - www.swatheadsets.com (http://www.swatheadsets.com)
Title: Re: Gear & YOU: Working Towards A Better Future (TM)
Post by: Bully Dog Airsoft on February 09, 2009, 02:35:17 PM
Ok thanks! I've been looking for that stuff forever.
Title: Re: Gear & YOU: Working Towards A Better Future (TM)
Post by: Bully Dog Airsoft on February 23, 2009, 02:06:04 PM
For anyone looking to use a headset to use with a motorla talkabout or simaler 2 way radio here is a great headset from Airsoft GI,  [smilie=armata_pdt_06.gif]

http://www.airsoftgi.com/product_info.php?cPath=29_64&products_id=4722

Here is the same headset but with a smaller plug,

http://www.airsoftgi.com/product_info.php?cPath=29_64&products_id=4715
Title: Re: Gear & YOU: Working Towards A Better Future (TM)
Post by: halfwayhero on August 08, 2009, 12:04:40 AM
i play cqb the most, what kind of gear would be the best for me?
Title: Re: Gear & YOU: Working Towards A Better Future (TM)
Post by: DaGunner on August 08, 2009, 12:00:46 PM
Bullydog you can get that same headset for 24 bucks on ebaybanned. At least I'm pretty sure, correct me if I'm wrong.
Title: Re: Gear & YOU: Working Towards A Better Future (TM)
Post by: Bully Dog Airsoft on August 08, 2009, 01:34:44 PM
Thanks for the info, always good to get it cheaper if you can.
Title: Re: Gear & YOU: Working Towards A Better Future (TM)
Post by: Ninja on August 27, 2009, 01:24:28 PM
I wish water cancelled out the weight of everything else I carry...  [smilie=armata_pdt_05.gif]
Title: Re: Gear & YOU: Working Towards A Better Future (TM)
Post by: busta_cap on January 29, 2010, 06:36:33 AM
Quote from: "Ninja"
I wish water cancelled out the weight of everything else I carry...  [smilie=armata_pdt_05.gif]

God I hate reviving old threads but...To address this comment..If you are in even average shape..you shouldn't have an issue carrying around 20-30lbs of airsoft gear on your upper body..The problem is that most people are not in shape at all..so they huff and puff and pass the hell out. :shock:  If you find yourself in this position at airsoft mock battles, try tossing on a backpack or your gear(not to the extent of weapons) and run or jog a half mile a day and gradually increase your duration and speed..It gets pretty easy after a while. I know this is all common sense, but considering how fat these country is getting, best be hopping on that treadmill! :idea:
Title: Re: Gear & YOU: Working Towards A Better Future (TM)
Post by: Wolfan8or on January 30, 2010, 01:41:39 AM
+1 busta

the stuff isn't too heavy, youre just too outta shape to carry it
Title: Re: Gear & YOU: Working Towards A Better Future (TM)
Post by: Ganef on January 30, 2010, 03:15:26 PM
Conversation about working out is not what this thread is about.

Getting in shape is a good idea in general, however there are ways to rethink your kit and trim some excess fat that isnt useful. I used to carry 13mags on me but after a few large games I found that even in the heaviest of firefights, I only went through about 5-6 mags. So I cut my load in half and supplemented it with more ability to reload. Thinking objectively about what you carry and trimming the excess is what Raith was getting at with this thread, i.e. fine tuning your kit to optimize performance. Fine tuning yourself is a whole different discussion.
Title: Re: Gear & YOU: Working Towards A Better Future (TM)
Post by: Sergeant First Class Keenan on January 30, 2010, 09:18:53 PM
So true.

30-45 minutes 3 times a week of mild cardio (tred-mil, stair stepper, olpitcal, ect) will really help throw in 1 minute of push ups (on your knees to begin with) and 1 minute of crunches 3 times a week will make airsoft easier, and life in general better.

Honestly if your winded standing in line waiting to order your super size combo meal, airsoft might not be the hobby for you. And god knows the Army National Guard aint gonna be in your future.

Anyway. Learning how to wear your gear the right way, (back pack on tight and high, not droopy) evened outload, not hauling around more then needed, ect all help.
Title: Re: Gear & YOU: Working Towards A Better Future (TM)
Post by: Shadow on April 12, 2010, 11:45:54 AM
I've been impressed with the quality of gear and the resourcefulness of the setups veteran players have posted on this thread.  It's given us (at least me) a nice template to work from and build towards.  That said, I hope this is ok to post because I'm sure there are a lot of people on here who are starting from the ground-up on putting together a rig, and might want to see something that is not yet finished.  It can be a daunting and expensive task, but as Bob said... baby steps!  I thought I would post my work in progress based on some of the rigs I've seen on here (thanks Raith & Ares) .  If I'm crossing lines, let me know.

As of right now, I've got a TacForce Plate carrier in coyote brown, 3 dual M4 mag pouches, a black roll-up dump pouch (from my previous, black I.T. chest rig), molle attached Camelback with 2L bladder, grey shemagh.

I took the ammunition/water approach, in that order.

Mags:
I set all my mags to bullets-forward, like Raith.  I like having the ability to pull it out of the pouch with my thumb and flip it right side up quickly to insert.  Since I haven't invested in Ranger plates, I've constructed my own magpul assists out of paracord and electrical tape.  There is not very much grip on the mag when it's in the pouch, so yanking it out hasn't caused the tape to lose the cord.  I go prone often (I'm sneaky like that), so one mag in each pouch slot work best for me... helps me keep a lower profile when in the dirt.  I'm not a big fan of the velcro enclosures because of the sound it gives off when reloading, so I tuck the flaps behind the mag/elastic strap to help the mag fit tighter in the slot.  I'm considering changing to the Kydex pouches.  My mag pouches are at 12 o'clock and 3 o'clock.  The mag pouch at 5 o'clock is currently used for pistol loaders, a leatherman and a camera.  When I get a chuckwalla, the mag pouch will probably to go the 9 o'clock position for reloading assistance (dump pouch to mag pouch during downtime), and the chuckwalla will take its place at 4-5 o'clock.

Dump:
I keep my dump pouch at the 7 o'clock position so it doesn't bounce off the back of my legs when running.  The smaller dump pouch works for me because I rarely clear more than 3 mags at a time (considering I currently have 4... it's a good way to learn how to conserve shots  :D  ).  I've never lost a mag out of the dump pouch, but I'll go with a deeper one when I acquire more mags.  I plan on carrying about 8 total.

I've also got a pen-screwdriver on the front in case it's needed for a quick hopup adjustment.

(http://www.canofrags.com/misc_images/gear_2.png)

(http://www.canofrags.com/misc_images/gear_3.png)

Soon to be added in order of importance:
* Chuckwalla by Ganef - I've learned that several pistol loaders are fantastic for reloading as opposed to the XL loader, at least for me.  It's much quieter and a lot easier to keep count so I don't overload the mag.  I've got 8 pistol loaders on order to allow ~800 rounds ready for reload.  This would give me about ~1600 rounds total without going back to cars where right now I'm carrying ~500.
* Radio - I have a pouch ready for an Icom, but need to pick one up.  I dislike shouting as it gives my position away  :-#
* Hand-made (http://www.freewebs.com/nrgmechanics/550paracordsling.htm) paracord, single-point sling (working on it now)
* 3L bladder for Camelback.  2L is decent and gets me by during short games, but I often run out toward the end.  More water would be ideal now that it is heating up.
* Neoprene Camelback tube cover, to hide the blue color.
* Simple First Aid kit - luckily haven't needed one yet... but the Boy Scout in me says to be prepared...
* Admin Pouch - good for those acquired patches and maps for ops.

All this is possible thanks to those who have posted their setups before, and I've only been playing airsoft for a little less than a year.  I've learned to take my time putting things together and do lots of research, otherwise I end up spending more $$$ than I need to.
Title: Re: Gear & YOU: Working Towards A Better Future (TM)
Post by: fragfest2012 on April 19, 2010, 10:28:12 PM
Raith, I was wondering what rig you had and how much it costs.
by rig, i mean just the base of it all
Title: Re: Gear & YOU: Working Towards A Better Future (TM)
Post by: Raith on April 20, 2010, 12:00:09 AM
Quote from: "fragfest2012"
Raith, I was wondering what rig you had and how much it costs.
by rig, i mean just the base of it all

The base is a chest rig that was made by Ganef.  I don't know what he charges for them now.
Title: Re: Gear & YOU: Working Towards A Better Future (TM)
Post by: fragfest2012 on April 20, 2010, 07:54:52 PM
also, where do you guys get all your coyote tactical stuff
Title: Re: Gear & YOU: Working Towards A Better Future (TM)
Post by: Ganef on April 20, 2010, 09:43:15 PM
coyotetactical.blogspot.com
Title: Re: Gear & YOU: Working Towards A Better Future (TM)
Post by: Airsofter1 on April 20, 2010, 10:12:41 PM
There's some pretty cool stuff I haven't seen from you before, broski.
Title: Re: Gear & YOU: Working Towards A Better Future (TM)
Post by: Ganef on April 21, 2010, 03:19:37 PM
That blog is only the tip of the iceberg of all the projects I have done over time.
Title: Re: Gear & YOU: Working Towards A Better Future (TM)
Post by: fragfest2012 on April 21, 2010, 07:07:55 PM
ok, cool ill check it out
Title: Re: Gear & YOU: Working Towards A Better Future (TM)
Post by: CBDennis on December 06, 2010, 09:46:30 PM
Ok, after all the questions I got at Gold War I figured I just post it on here and talk about it a bit. Fair warning my camera isn’t the best so I just snapped two pictures and I’ll just go over what is on it. Here is my rig.
(http://i42.photobucket.com/albums/e318/Rooster86/PIC_0064.jpg)
(http://i42.photobucket.com/albums/e318/Rooster86/PIC_0066.jpg)

I have it set up just like I did in Iraq for the most part. I don’t run with an IFAC or any first aid kit on my vest because, so fare, I have had no need for one on my vest. I carry my small first aid kit on my go-bag at the staging area.

The Vest
It is an IOTV replica, not sure the manufacturer but good stitching and not too pricey when I bought it. I run with the IOTV because it is what I am use to and I have all the MOLLE room in the world for anything and everything I need. I’ll go over what I carry from my 12’ and go counter clockwise.

Magazines:
My mags are rounds to the left and upside down. I took of the front retaining static cords off because in my experience there is no need for them, plus it makes them faster to retrieve. The mag pouch is at my 12 o'clock.

40mm Grenade pouch:
At my 11 o'clock, I carry 2 - 120 round Madbull 40mm grenades and I have 1 – 60 rounder in the tube.

Chuckwalla:
At my 9 o'clock I have my chuckwalla which has: 5 speed loaders, bottle of BBs, extra battery, 2 foam 203 balls and a multi tool in it. Also a death rag in the pull tab on the front. I carry all of that for extended missions and to help out a teammate if need be.

Dump pouch:
It is a WTF ATACS dump pouch which is directly below the chuckwalla. I keep it at the 9 o'clock position so it doesn't bounce off my legs when running. Also I like it there because that’s where I have trained with it and that’s what my muscle memory is right now. I find it easy to clear the mag from my weapon, dump it, retrieve and new mag and continue to fire within 5-6 seconds. I don’t need a 3 second speed set up because I find no use for them, I’m always behind cover when I’m reloading and I have my team mate there who covers my sector while I reload. But still 5-6 seconds is plenty fast for me.

Radio pouch:
At my 7 o'clock,I carry an ICOM F4S radio. I run the wires threw the mole webbing to the PTT button on the front left of my vest so it will not get caught up on anything or anyone.

Hydration carrier:
At my 6 o'clock, I have a 3 liter camelback with the hose running over my left shoulder to keep my primary firing shoulder free.

Fragmentation Grenades pouch:
At my about 4 o'clock, I have 2 frag grenades. I carry them there because I am right handed and with real ones you always want 100% positive control over your grenades and that’s where I have always carried them. If I’m throwing a grenade I am not using my firing hand so that’s where I train to have them.

Sidearm:
At my 3 o'clock, I have my M9 strike adapter. I never like having equipment on my legs so I moved it there and loved it ever since.

And that will about do it. I sometimes have my double pistol mag pouch on my upper chest by I rarely need extra pistol magazines. If you can’t eliminate your target with you primary or secondary with in 1 mag, you’re already in trouble. I have never had to use more than 1 mag. As soon as I transition to my side arm and eliminate the target I clear the malfunction of my primary and continue mission.
Title: Re: Gear & YOU: Working Towards A Better Future (TM)
Post by: deathbydanish on July 26, 2011, 06:42:29 PM
Nice setup Dennis, I am kind of a function over form kind of guy myself, I generally don't care if gear isn't considered "tacticool" as long as its practical for my use. I wouldn't worry too much about first aid, as long as you stick with your team you should be good to go, after all this is just airsoft. For all the times that I've suffered injury (usually leg/foot) I was usually within visual range of other players so I never had to worry much. Overall I like your setup, it seems practical and very well thought out, if it works for you, then it works
Title: Re: Gear & YOU: Working Towards A Better Future (TM)
Post by: desert rat on July 03, 2012, 03:10:29 PM
Question where did you get your radios? That is one thing I am still trying to narrow down on. I have my gear picked out but those.
Title: Re: Gear & YOU: Working Towards A Better Future (TM)
Post by: DMAN007 on July 03, 2012, 03:32:12 PM
Question where did you get your radios? That is one thing I am still trying to narrow down on. I have my gear picked out but those.
If you're looking for an Icom F4s Try RedDogRadios...
http://www.reddogradios.com/index.php?subcats=Y&status=A&pshort=Y&pfull=Y&pname=Y&pkeywords=Y&search_performed=Y&cid=0&q=f4s&x=0&y=0&dispatch=products.search (http://www.reddogradios.com/index.php?subcats=Y&status=A&pshort=Y&pfull=Y&pname=Y&pkeywords=Y&search_performed=Y&cid=0&q=f4s&x=0&y=0&dispatch=products.search)
Title: Re: Gear & YOU: Working Towards A Better Future (TM)
Post by: desert rat on July 03, 2012, 03:58:42 PM
Thanks I am looking for reliable equipment