Well, I know what gun I want next.

[RickEJ6]

Well, the Army saw it melt, not me personally.  And the fact is that it is NOT getting ordered right now.  I would be more inclined to like the weapon if it say, fixed any of the problems of M4, like the fact that the 14.5 inch barrel isnt long enough to make the M855 ammo effective.  And the XM8 has a SHORTER barrel.  It just doesnt work.

Its also a G36 based design which is also not the best weapon to start with.  The Germans (I believe) starting using the G36s in afghanistan (Again, it could be Iraq....I just woke up...haha) and quickly switched back to the old G3s after the G36s didnt cut it.

And yes, I HAVE seen a LMG after a few hundred rounds. Not sure why that matters. The SAW will fire up to the point where the barrel is literally white hot.  The XM8 obviously failed long before that.

Rick

[Mugen]

New here...but am gonna go all out.  I am currently scoping out the new Gas Sniper rifle m700, and for a primary the G36a AEG.  That rifle is SWEEEEEET!

[na10tbolt]

They already make a Chauchat replica.  It's called the electric Uzi at Jungle Toy.   Make a replica Chauchat out of some metal tubes and put the Uzi from Jungle Toy inside.  The final product would have realistic weight, size, materials, and similiar performance to the real gun.

[Bucket]

They already make a Chauchat replica.  It's called the electric Uzi at Jungle Toy.   Make a replica Chauchat out of some metal tubes and put the Uzi from Jungle Toy inside.  The final product would have realistic weight, size, materials, and similiar performance to the real gun.

 :lol:  :lol:  :lol:  :lol:


How true How true!

[Firehead]

 I am currently scoping out the new Gas Sniper rifle m700,

Good choice. I got to check it out, and that is a SWEET rifle. Just a few more days and its mine....

[Mugen]

I had a few more questions about an A.E.G./S.M.G. for sale...I saw it at the store ever so briefly, it was a Silenced MP5 with a full stock, it felt really good, and seemed quality made...I have deduced that it is one of two guns.....a) Tokyo Marui's MP5SD5, or a Classic Army MP5SD5, I am thinking it is the later....but I am unsure.  Both designations for the same model are the same.....and the pictures online is almost impossible to destinguish between the two....help!

Which is more desirable?

[Vince]

Since when are they called SMP? I'm pretty sure they're called MP5SD5/6. The difference is if the body was metal or not. CAs are metal.

[DUDE]

Mud always gets in the magazine and its a sun of a gun to clean.

[Surplus man]

I will take an XM8, although it's critisized by many, It has a flawless design. There is an awesome article from last months issue of American Rifleman. You can beat the hell out of an XM8(yes more so than any AK)and it will rock out like no other. They completely submerged it in mud and fired it... I think the maintenance was something like every 80k rounds...

One of the best features of the XM8 is the recessed. self-leveling piccatinny system. Once you zero something, even when taken off it will stay zero'd perfectly as long as it is put back on the same point (S).

You did hear that it is on hold because of overheating issues?  It does everything well on paper....but MELTS in the real world.  Yeah...great rifle...

i agree, lets see the xm8 put up a good 60 years of service before we say its better than the trusty ak-47. we cant afford forget the blunder our own airforce made in the early 60's with rushing the m16 into service. it may look cool and futuristic, but looks truly can be decieving. im glad the army's taking its time in testing , we've no need to rush a new toy then see the casualties pile up as the weapon's malfunctions come out of the woodwork. (case in point m16).

i'll take my weapon pre field proven, and if that means settling with iron and wood, im down.

[DJ NeX]

Its interesting....Good luck with that.

[RickEJ6]

i agree, lets see the xm8 put up a good 60 years of service before we say its better than the trusty ak-47. we cant afford forget the blunder our own airforce made in the early 60's with rushing the m16 into service. it may look cool and futuristic, but looks truly can be decieving. im glad the army's taking its time in testing , we've no need to rush a new toy then see the casualties pile up as the weapon's malfunctions come out of the woodwork. (case in point m16).

i'll take my weapon pre field proven, and if that means settling with iron and wood, im down.[/quote]

Im bored, so Ill bite.

Have you ever used an AK in the field?  If not, then you are just going by what you have read about them.  I HAVE used an M4, M16, and AK in force on force and range enviroments.  The BS about the AK being the king of reliablity is just that, BS.  It will shoot crappier ammo, and is a bit more lenient on how often you have to clean it, but they DO FAIL.  This summer alone I went through 3 different AKs that just kept failing on me.  I ended up with a well beat up M4 that NEVER had a problem.  If you ever did use an AK you would be familiar with their crappy sights, less than ideal accuracy, and horrible safety design.  

The negatives:

1. The safety doesnt permit the gun to be carried on safe on a patrol and then switched to fire immediately on contact.  This summer a SF candidate was removed from the course with only 3 days to go before graduation because of an accidental discharge he had with his AK.  After that point those with AKs were forced to carry them on fire but without a round in the chamber and then chamber a round upon contact.  Less than ideal.  The M16 is far superior.

2. The whole "knock down" power crap.  The gun has crappy sights, crappy egronomics, and the accuracy isnt up to par.  Which leaves you with a heavier bullet missing the target.  It doesnt matter how much lead you throw at a target, if you cant get reliable hits, the weapon is useless.  The M16 is far superior.

3.  Have you ever put more than a few rounds down the barrel of an AK with the wood grips?  After only a few rounds (less than 100) the foregrip became so hot so as I was unable to hold it securely and get hits.  Once again, a rifle that you cannot get hits with its USELESS.  I was able to fire a M16A2 until the front part of the handgaurds melted (in excess of 200 rounds in rapid sucession) and I was able to place all the rounds on my intended target.  

Until you use the weapon in a real enviroment, you can only go on hearsay on how they perform.  The weapon our troops are being issued today is truly one of the best rifles around.  (Then theres the whole HK416 and Sig 552...but yeah...)

Rick

[Surplus man]

you do know i was agreeing with you right? the m16 had its bugs worked out but it did cost some americans in vietnam thier lives in the pentagons rush to phase out the trusty m14. despite the "crappy" aspect of an ak it still keeps on ticking even afyter 60 years, that says a little bit about its quality build. i have used a real ak-47 it was hungarian made but it belonged to my best friends dad, and he let me get it dirty and drop it a few times to prove to me they werent poorly made guns (i did not beat it to the extent of actual combat use) but i glimpsed the quality. if you hold an ak too close to the ventilators, it gets hot on the hands much more quickly. all guns heat up but you cant melt wood after 200 "plus rounds" ...not too keen on the thought of an m16 melting in my hands. i was able to put 7 30 round mags through the ak with it getting hot but not hot enough to stop touching. yes the modern m16 is quality (wish it had a bigger caliber) but hey for what it is, it's very accurate, and a good rifle. but it did take years of tuning to make it as such. i wont slam on american rifles, we make some of the best guns on the face of the planet. but despite the ak's cons it does have benefits; long lifespan, better killing capacity (7.62x39 will do a bit more damage than 5.56), simplicity of design, and you can find them every where. in agreeance, i think for now the m16 is still far superior to the xm8 (the m16 has run its trials and has been proven) and they should work out the melting issue before its even considered.

[pythonline]

The xm8 is pretty exciting, I've only heard about it from articles in magazines, but still pretty cool, assuming it works as predicted.

as for the whole ak/m16 thing.

I have not fired an m16, but I have put many rounds through my ak.  I've never had a problem with it, actually, the only thing I have against it is that you can't force the chamber to stay open.

I am probably more accurate with my ak's irons than most people are with scoped m16s, I have never had a problem with them, even at 100+ yards.

no, I haven't been in the field, so I really can't put that perspective in it, but I have heard nothing but praise for the ak's reliablility.

as for the m16, from what I've heard from friends of mine who fire it, they are excellent weapons.  Naturally the older ones were pieces of s***, but I think we can move past that, it was almost 40 years ago.

I don't know if I could really say one is better than the other, because they are so different that each have their own qualities that make them "better" or "worse" than the other.

there are also some things that some would see as an advantage, but others would see as a disadvantage.

one example, from what I've heard, the ak weighs substantially more than the m16.

obvious problem is that its harder to carry, less effective in close combat.

the advantage is that slight muscle twitches will move it less while trying to aim long range.

[m-79_Grenadier]

America needs another John Browning. He is singlehandedly the most important figure in firearms design in all of history. Nearly all of the guns he designed are still being produced today, and all of the principles he designed are in use with nearly every firearm that we own. We owe it to him for bringing us fom muzzleloaders, to fully automatic gas powered machine guns in a span of only about 30 years. His designs were genious to say the least. If you notice he designed one weapon that has served our military for nearly 100 years, and is still unmatched in its field. That weapon is the .50 BMG, and it was first adopted in 1913!
The Same exact principle that was used in his infamous BAR is still being used in the belgain MAG58. And if you think about it, its literally impossible to improve on the overall design of the 1911 pistol series, save for grips and bushings and such. He gave us nearly half of the weapons that were issued during WWI and WWII, and some up into vietnam. Ive heard stories of tunnel rats in vietnam  being nearly buried and their .45 still fired every round flawlessly when things got hairy.

We need to have another firearms genious to arm our military. You can bicker about the guns we use today, but befoe you make up your mind, think about the ones that proved themselves years before, and even into tomorrow.

[DUDE]

The trusty BAR one of the best battle impliment ever devised.